VeganAwake

Everything and nothing simultaneously perfect zero ❤

Exactly, everything being experienced is whole complete and perfect because it's what is!! It's sooo here that it's often overlooked. ❤

That's awesome and what's being experienced there...❤

@Moksha hi there...❤ I was wondering from your perspective if you have experienced any value/benefit in understanding or recognizing so called Ultimate Reality?

The apparent issue with the knower is it believes there is an Ultimate Reality that can be known with enough persistent practice and inquiry. See even if the apparent 'knower' discovered the almighty creator of the universe, it would then ask "well what created the Creator"? ? So when the one asking these why questions is recognized to be completely unreal.... the answer to why ends up being.... Who cares?

Yep that's the cosmic joke. The recognition or understanding of THIS is also devoid of any real meaning purpose or value. In that sense it's not special and the one that attaches a specialness concept to it, is Maya illusion of the self. It's ordinary and extraordinary for no one and even this is just a dream story. The empty full ❤

The sacred knowledge bit always sells.

Totally get it, sometimes it feels as if we're taking steps backwards ❤ Sounds like 'you' are on the cusp of recognizing the limitations of listening and identifying with mind. Notice how the mind/ego/sense of self is always dragging us around looking for the grass is always greener on the other side scenario. Notice how even the desire to recognize everything as love is just another egoic desire subtly implying that what's Here and Now isn't already unconditional love or perfection. The Mind keeps saying: see what you're seeking is just around the next corner... but the corners never end lol.... it doesn't want to recognize the hamster wheel effect just runs us in circles endlessly. It's the weirdest thing because in the end, the very energy dragging us around seeking for fulfillment, love and liberation, turns out to be completely unreal. When the judgemental seeking energy dies, the concept clouds evaporate revealing the bright, perfect radiance of what was always here just waiting to be recognized. It's Freedom it's the Kingdom of Heaven it's Paradise....

Yeah when this is truly seen it can be that terrifying holy crap moment...? There's nothing to grasp ahold of when meaning purpose and value concepts shatter...? Of course it's always been the case so nothing really happend...? The real/unreal empty/full unconditional freedom for no one ❤

See how 'you' were born into a family which was conditioned by the environment around them and so on to the beginning of time.... it's completely radical and unfathomable... I mean look at it...we are literally a product of existence. Its a truly unknowable and unexplainable happening... the real and unreal. What's not to love ❤ regardless of circumstance. The unconditional love of everything exactly the way it is because it is what is.

The "Mystery"? "The nature of ultimate reality can only be understood when looking from its own viewpoint. That is to say, one’s conditioned perspective of reality must be put aside. The simplest explanation is to consider that one’s life in the world and universe has the characterization of a dream. Into this dream, each dreamer is born. To the dreamer, the world and universe have the appearance of being real. The dreamer takes himself to be real, and therefore the world and universe this person is “in” to be real. The dreamer “knows” that he has “come into” this life, therefore at some point he will “go out” of life. The dreamer “knows” that although he will die, the world and universe and fellow dreamers will persists after his death; that the dream will continue when the dreamer no longer exists. None of this is so. When the dreamer ceases to be, the dream ceases to be. The dream has never been real. The dreamer has never been real. In other words, an unreal dreamer dreams a dream that is unreal. Only if the person, the world, and universe were real would any of this be justified to have an explanation. Any explanation would entail the process of cause—and—effect, time and space (or location). Ultimate reality has no relationship to time, space or cause –and—effect. These are elements which occur only within the dream. Only within the dream is it a legitimate question to ask, “How then can life and the world and universe be?” Any answer would entail the processes of time, space and cause—and—effect. Such processes occur only within the dream itself. Therefore, any answer will be an answer within the unreal dream. The point is that all that is apparent to the dreamer is simply that: an illusory appearance. What appears to be real or actual is not the same thing as what is real or actual. What is actual, is ultimate reality. Ultimate reality can be characterized as empty; no-thing or nothingness. Ultimate reality is absent any of the qualities of the dream. Being emptiness itself, it has no need of an explanation or a justification. There are no questions which one can ask about nothing. Questions and answers are a product of the dream. Nothing is not the cause of anything or the effect of anything. Cause —and—effect is a process only within the dream. So, if we ask, “What is the cause of the unreal dream?”, the cause is the unreal dreamer. An apparent dreamer interacts in an apparent world in an apparent universe. None of what appears to be is actual. What appears as “real” within the dream is not actual, not ultimate reality. To understand ultimate reality, one must go “outside” the conditioned perspective that is within the dream. It can only be understood from the standpoint that no thing is real. Nothingness is what’s real. From the standpoint of nothingness, it is clear that not anything in our dream world, including oneself, is important. None of the activities in the world matter “outside of” the unreal dream. There is no meaning in life, in an ultimate sense. Anything which is to be taken “seriously” is within the unreal dream. Whatever you do, or anyone else does (or doesn’t do), does not matter in any real sense. This insight is the freedom which one can experience within the dream. It is justified on its own terms." -- Robert Wolfe (Ajata Project)

This is good inquiry ❤ 'I' think of the mind like a runaway train, sure it's an aspect of Consciousness as 'you' put it, but that doesn't negate the fact that it has become an entity unto itself. Simply put...it's getting too much attention. The thoughts themselves aren't the apparent issue....the issue is the value and identification as 'MY' thoughts which so to speak keeps giving the runaway train fuel... if you keep popping quarters into the think machine, it keeps thinking. Don't get 'me' wrong, some thoughts are apparently useful like: maybe 'I' shouldn't go ?, there appears to be sharks in the water or maybe 'I' shouldn't drive after these several beers since there's 3 three confirmed DUI checkpoints randomly placed. When these blah blah blah thoughts aren't constantly entertained and energized/identified with, they lesson and become the background noise instead of the forefront. Mind is Playing Tricks, it says: See it's all Consciousness very relevant and important, keep feeding me and paying attention. Is consciousness just an aspect of the Mind? Truly inquire non-biasedly!! If the Mind becomes a vegetable, is consciousness still there? If the body/mind got annihilated by a 75 mile an hour semi truck, is apparent Consciousness still there, or is it all just a dream thought.

@billiesimon ❤ "Mind contemplated "What is Mind?" for several days and this is what Mind found" Is 'I' something other than Mind?

Because it knows satisfaction with "what's here" will put it out of a job. "Its dictates, then, can be summed up simply as: "Seek and do not find." -- A Course in Miracles ❤

Exactly, it can't be done wrong when wrong ends up being a concept within everything. ❤

What you're missing is that if nothing matters you're free to also pursue anything you want in life... Yep its that free..❤

Its not an exclusive experience, its all inclusive. Its every experience with the underlying recognition that the separate sense of 'I' constantly judging everything from self centered perception is an illusion or misidentification with conditioned thoughts ideas beliefs perceptions labels and contracted energy in the body. The game of life doesn't stop being played... this has been called The Divine game of Lila or dabbling back in duality. In that sense 'nothing matters' is the freedom to participate in life without the egoic self agenda constantly scrutinizing or requiring things to be one way or the other for fulfillment or satisfaction to be available. It's the freedom of things being exactly as they are. Because really the only thing that would say otherwise is a conditioned thought(what's in it for me mentality) I'm sure there are some that sit on the couch digging into a pint of ice cream saying nothing really matters so what's the point... but I find that very rarely and it could also be tied in depression or other mental disorders which can be inevitable experiences. It's not somewhere else it's THIS ❤

What matters: "The word “nothingness” means “nonexistence, emptiness”; the dictionary adds “death.” “Emptiness” means “concerning nothing; meaningless.” “Void” means “without effect”. The enlightened teachers tell us that nothingness is the final or ultimate reality. Not final in the sense our lives are final, but ultimate in the sense of fundamental, or real; beyond which nothing more can be said. There being not two things which are real or fundamental, nothingness is what is not unreal—as are all other things. All that we take to be existent is not “nothingness”. When one genuinely comes to recognize the truth of this description, it is as good as acknowledging that one is dead, or not “living”: non-existent. Yes, there are the appearances; but the comprehension is that they are not the reality. The reality is that appearances are meaningless. When one perceives that he is nonexistent, or “dead” to all but appearances, what can be a trouble? Can any apparent situation really matter? Even if it were to seem to matter, is this not simply just an appearance? To one who is aware of this, it is clear that nothing really matters!" -- Robert Wolfe https://ajatasunyata.com/

Oh yeah of course ❤..the ordinariness is the extraordinariness when everything is acceptable... right wrong.. in out.. this or that... Its all IT....even the unacceptance is IT!! complete ❤

https://ajatasunyata.com/

'I' don't get it...? Yet its apparently recognized...❤

Watch an animal apparently make a choice to eat some more food, take a drink of water or walk away...watch closely... Does the choice just happen? 'WE' can create stories all day long.... oh he's a chowhound...oh she's not much into this food ...he likes to be by himself... on and on the stories go. Wait this gets better ? Can a thought effect action ? If so, was this thought a real choice? Or did it just arise due to conditioning? Was it REALLY a free choice? ❤

It doesn't matter... And that's the freedom here...

Its the state of exactly what's happening ?

Totally got nothing out of it but it was incredible hearing no one's different experiences and perspectives. They did send a thank you for attending email and certificate ❤ ?