VeganAwake

The true self is spiritual ego... it's an illusory identification. Ego equals identification. Enlightenment is literally the end of any kind of identification as this or that... The changes that occur after Enlightenment are because it's clearly seen that the ego or sense of self was just trying to put itself into a better situation..... so those desires tend to just fall the way on their own, it's not something that's forced. Its fair game after enlightenment... sometimes things drastically change and other times they barely change at all. For example of father-of-five children that awakens might still continue to be a crane operator making $90 an hour to support the family. Before Enlightenment chop wood carry water, after Enlightenment chop wood carry water. ❤

That's very generous of you ❤

There may be a way to also set up suicidal red flag warning notification for certain words like: jump; end; kill; hurt; die etc... This may already be the case. ❤

Maybe you can become a moderator to help with such issues. Get a chance to experience things on the flip side sort of speak. ❤

No difference at all because enlightenment is not real, it's the end of something that never occurred. It's an illusory collapse of an illusory individual that seemed to have free will and choice to chase or not chase. If you look closely though, everyone is chasing something whether it be materialism or spiritual materialism: success, wealth, great family, nice car, beautiful clothes, expensive jewelry, enlightenment hehe. ❤

With all due respect to his family, friends and this community. It's nobody's fault... nobody's. Like Leo said, nobody really knows what was going on there. Often times this sort of thing is long planned and hidden very well so it won't be interrupted unfortunately. In 2013 we lost a friend that was playing poker with us the very night before he shot himself in the armory the next morning... literally no one saw it coming, it was absolutely mind-boggling and tragic at the time. There are lots of Suicide Prevention programs available nowadays.... the one they taught us was called ACT. A-ask C-care T-treat ❤

? or another way to put it: Nothing is asking nothing is this real or illusion?

With no knower its absolutely nothing. Not even one. And yes concepts of non duality and void are recognized as nothing. Even the recognition that it is nothing is also nothing. ?

No one puts importance on it. There isn't a YOU. It's an illusion within the body that feels separate and is trying to find a solution to make itself feel whole and complete. It often tries with material possessions or spiritual materialism. ❤

There is no point and no meaning purpose or value to it either. Enlightenment is the death of that which places imaginary values on top of reality.

Exactly, the deconstruction is the only thing that is completely unreal. The deconstruction is simultaneously the recognition that there wasn't anyone that could be deconstructed in the first place. Nothing actually changes because it was already the case. And simultaneously it's completely different. ❤

Unknowing is the collapse of the knower.

Nice investigation ? Yes the "I" is an assumption... it just seems so obvious that it's never actually closely inspected. Notice it's more than just a thought though... it is an actual experience. It creates an I am here and everything else is out there and I have to defend myself experience. Keep watching it ❤

"An Empty Answer You want me to “say more” about nothingness. Could anything be more paradoxical for the reader than to try to understand “nothing”? Why? Because most people start from the conviction that there is something which does exist; if nothing more, at least “me”. So, you will not likely appreciate nothingness unless you have come to realization through advaita. At least we will, then, begin without the assumption that a “me” really exists. But even for the realized advatin, there will almost certainly be a presumption that “something” exists in the realm of reality. Even “reality”. Advaita points to ajata, and ajata is about nothingness, or emptiness. The Diamond Sutra of Buddhism, points exclusively to it. Hui Neng, the Sixth Chinese Patriarch, declares flatly: ‘There is nothing from the start.” These sources, among others, set your foot on the path, but recognize that most people are then going to immediately be lost. I have written clearly about advaita, and several have understood what I’ve said. I have spoken, to some of these, about what lies beyond the “Absolute,” and a couple have understood. So I will try to explain it, as best I can. The “ultimate condition” (if any) is nothingness, the complete “absence” of anything—no thing, of any possible description. The (approximate) comprehension of this would be to conceive of “emptiness”, as the emptiness of which not anything could be emptied; pure unassociated emptiness, and not even an emptiness which is within some imagined boundaries. The word “void” could be applied; but this “actuality” is not void of something—in any positive sense. So the nothingness of which we speak is totally empty, free of any subtlety which could even be envisioned. Hence there is not anything “within” it that can be subject to any kind of movement, or even change. Not anything can “come from” nothingness, nor “return” to it. It is not the “origin” of anything. In fact, it could not be applicable to say that it exists, or does not exist. Thus we can’t say that this is the “beginning” condition or the “ending” condition. At best, we could say that (if it were “existent”) it would be the ever-present condition. Yet, it is not an abstraction: its presence is “eternal”. “In” its presence are supposed creatures, and the world and universe they seem to inhabit. But all of these supposed things are “in” nothingness. They have not appeared from nothingness, or out of nothingness, or because of nothingness. In fact, they have not actually “appeared”, except as nothingness. The creatures take their reality, their “existence”, for granted; and thus also the reality or existence of the world and its universe—not knowing that they are nothing. The assumption is: ‘There was a time when I didn’t exist, a time when I existed, and a time when I will no longer exist”. But there are no such times. Not anything has ever “existed”, from the standpoint of nothingness. In nothingness, there is no “time”. What makes this so difficult to understand, is that because we say that “I have existed”, we conclude that there is some thing. And indeed we look around and say there are other things, such as a world or a universe. But the presumption that there was a time when I did not exist (or do; or will not exist) is false: no arising, abiding or decaying exists in nothingness. In other words, not anything “happens” in nothingness. “We” are nothing, the “world” is nothing, the “universe” is nothing. In nothingness, there is neither existence nor nonexistence. There is only nothing. From the standpoint of nothingness, no questions can arise. We can not ask for, nor expect, an explanation: not anything ever happens, in nothingness. The value of this understanding is that not anything really matters. Even understanding this does not matter. All is emptiness. That is the “empty” answer. The scriptures speak of one who is in sahaja samadhi as having “no mind” or an “empty mind”. It is this appreciation of nothingness that is referred to" - Robert Wolfe

There is nothing to drop already. That which thinks its something is already nothing.(illusion) Perfection was already at hand. "nothing matters" The illusion that something mattered just needed to be dropped. The veil of Illusion needed to dissolve. ❤

Yes there's only impermanence.... and even that is just a story. It's definitely not what the individual is seeking. The ME wants something solid to grasp, name, label and check-off as understood. THIS is unknowable.... and not because it can't be named, but because any name or meaning placed over top of it, is a projected idea at best. ❤

Let's put it this way: Say you were having a dream in which you were chasing a leprechaun that would grant you three wishes beyond your wildest dreams if he is caught. Then your alarm clock goes off and you wake up, but you still remember the dream very vividly. Would you quickly throw your socks and shoes on and run out the door trying to find this dream leprechaun?(don't answer that hehe) When Awakening occurs it's recognized that the individual and it's bundle of dream stories/beliefs and concepts never actually existed in reality. When the bottom of the bucket falls out, it never holds water again. When the snake is recognized as just a piece of rope it doesn't keep tricking you over and over again. When the foundation of Illusion dissolves under the weight of truth the Ivory Tower collapses. ❤

When you treat Illusions and dreams stories as if they are real, you are right back in the dream again. Nobody's doing or having them because they are simply already not real. This isn't directed at anybody in particular. ❤

Yes that much Freedom can malfunction ego. Particularly the part about nothing needing to be done. Ego perpetuates it's existence with meaning purpose and value. For ego there's always something else that needs to be attained no matter what. When it's recognized those illusory goals was just the ego construct itself at work, it starts to collapse under the weight of truth. The Ivory Tower gets very weak because its foundation is dissolving.

There's nothing missing and everything is already complete. This can be recognized and simultaneously it doesn't matter whether it is or isn't. ❤

Frank is enlightened. The difficulty is that the sense of self attempts to grasp, understand, embody and know what Frank is pointing to. In other words it tries to turn what's being pointed to, into a belief system. Enlightenment or Ajata is the transcendence or dropping of concepts, ideologies or belief's, because it transcends even the idea of there ever being an individual that could have had a belief system to hold onto. It literally transcends the entire dream story of a societally conditioned individual that may one day break out of the matrix and become liberated... Awakening is the recognition that the baby is not what he or she thinks it is. Enlightenment throws out the baby with the bathwater, obliterates the bathtub and burns the house down. Enlightenment is Illusions worst enemy. But that's just a story because enlightenment and illusion never actually occurred... it just seemed too ❤

?

Yes exactly, no body wakes up.

I get how it sounds....there's a reason why it's called Awakening ❤

Yes, and seems that way for the "I am".