VeganAwake

Haha I see what you're saying ... It was more along the lines of do what naturally makes you happy. As opposed to just following in somebody else's footsteps because they told you there experience was fun.

@arlin Correct.. I like to think about it as natural as possible. Like: What would I do if I was the only human on the planet? I would do whatever the hell I wanted = happiness is a choice.

@arlin Although I don't believe there is any true purpose in life other than just living. Finding true happiness is like the cherry on top of the ice cream sundae. ❤

It's because they don't resist life they just live it. When the constant monkey chatter of the mind is quieted life can be very enjoyable.(no mind) ?

This isn't directed at anyone this is just in general: You're more than welcome to wine and dine, nurture and love the heck out of your ego with all the compassion in the world....❤ I am just pointing out that, that approach is not going to lead to enlightenment (especially since it's an illusory sense of self). Enlightenment is not about attaining or adding something more to yourself, rather it's the dropping of the egoic self agenda altogether. It's dropping the labels of the false self peeling the onion layers off and completely detaching from this false sense of self. Most people are terrified of this Letting Go process. But when you understand your sense of self is an illusion it's easier to drop. We create layers upon layers a false beliefs about ourselves and then consider that to be our true self. When you shed the layers and realize you are nothing that you thought you were, you simultaneously realize you are everything. Your true self is found and you become aligned with Divine wisdom. Nobody can enter the gateless gate so be nobody!! What I have shared with you is from personal experience...I promise ❤ ❤

Hello, I'm not sure what you are referring to exactly, but everything I shared on here is from direct experience. ❤ ❤ have a good day my friend!!

@ivankiss thank you!! I understand what you are saying. Before Enlightenment chop wood carry water after Enlightenment chop wood carry water. In my experience though the egoic self agenda was completely seen through and the ignorance was dispelled. I could never go back to including it in my everyday life, because it(ego) was discovered to be an illusion, it was my false sense of self claiming to be my true self. The tricks of the ego were completely seen through. When you peel off the layers of your false self, it untangles you from social conditioning and you snap out of The Matrix. The end result is seeing that your own mind(ego) was keeping you in this prison with the belief that something outside of you will complete you. This is a radical shift that completely changes your entire life. Of course you still have to work and carry on normal life but the resistance to what is has been dropped. This resistance is what causes suffering. That's why so many describe Enlightenment as the end of suffering. Thank you for the conversation as well and many blessings to you my friend. ❤ ❤

I'm just confused on what your stance is with the ego in general. You have mentioned transcending, merging and inclusion.. so which is your final answer. I think you have tasted the honey and you can see what is possible.. I'm just confused on the recommendation of inclusion of the ego to the general public. I have never heard that before but you weren't the only one who said it so I guess it's pretty common on this forum I would imagine. If you have found peace and happiness then you are home. Nothing else needs to happen ❤ ❤ Take care and nice talking with you!!

@JustThinkingAloud I'm also sorry if I made it sound like an argument I'm working on my social skills every post. ❤ It just seemed like this was a very large misunderstanding that could easily cause confusion and possibly damage. With the ego you don't want to ignore or entertain you simply see it for what it is and it will fade into the nothingness where it came. This is the middle path ?

@JustThinkingAloud The ego is the false sense of self that believes it's lacking and needs to seek outside of it's self for completion. The very definition of ego is duality. See one has to understand this before going any further or you'll just keep confusing yourself and going in circles. You cannot integrate and align with something that's an illusion. You can have one without the other because one isint real. Its like continuously being tricked by a mirage in the desert but then saying well I need to integrate this into my survival strategy because it's all a part of reality, but then being tricked over and over again by The Mirage. It doesn't make any sense. This is quite literally the realization that comes with enlightenment. Do you understand now. It's like telling a schizophrenic just to integrate and align with their hallucinations and delusions. It's not going to help them see the truth anytime soon!!

Well I have already gone through this process that's why I'm speaking to it so passionately. ❤ This has been a common misconception that I've been reading about a lot lately in the New Age movement ..see what happens is people misunderstand the gurus and think they are saying they need to beat their ego into submission.(aka kill it) Understandably they don't agree with this method so their pendulum swings to the opposite side and they believe maybe we need to wine and dine and integrate the ego since its all divine. They don't understand the ego is not part of the human experience. It is a mind made program that is running you. It is an illusory sense of self and you can't integrate something that's an illusion. The only true obstacle to Enlightenment is ourselves. When we turn Enlightenment into a future event instead of something that can be realized now the ego has a Hay day with this because its survival depends on keeping this knowledge out of our grasp. The ego says seek but do not find. I am simply a sign pointing. Have a good day my friend ❤ ❤

@DrewNows Thank you for your comment!! Yes suffering is a catalyst for awakening but don't worry the ego is already onboard for 99.8% I guess one could say that both are valid ways of experiencing life: One leads to integrating an illusory false sense of self into everyday life, and the other is a sign pointing to truth, to liberation, to enlightenment. It is true that one could integrate a really inflated and painful ego into everyday life which could be a catalyst to Awakening, but I would rather just see the ego for what it is from the get-go and begin the dis identifying process.

@ivankiss @nightrider1435 I understand what you are both saying...trust me. I was not saying to kill the ego nor was I saying to befriend it or make it an enemy. But to simply see it for what it is...an illusion... when the ignorance is dispelled the truth is all that remains: The Ego is an effect. It arises from the belief in separation, and survives only by keeping this illusion going. The Ego will not be taken from you as long as you still have use for it; as long as you believe that the concepts of lack and separation are still of any benefit to you. The ego is Duality and Duality is an illusion. There never was a separate self. Never has been never will be, your ego is literally what has created this separate false sense of self. The easiest way to identify the ego is its sense of lack, the ego always wants more... more money more power more love more of everything, to become more spiritual... it's never satisfied. The ego does not want you to realize that you are already complete and perfect in every way. In fact the ego knows that if you realize this it will be the end of it. This is why the ego is so cunning!! This realization doesn't kill the ego, it simply deflates it...you see it's tricks and it can no longer keep you believing it is yourself. Once the ego sees that you have outsmarted it, it sits with its nose in the corner and whimpers in time-out lol. It's actually pretty funny when you see how cunning and clever it really is. Thousands of years in the making it has gotten very sneaky. I love you guys I hope this helps you or anyone else on their Journey ❤ ❤

@SoonHei thank you ❤

The ego is not part of the human experience. It is a mind made program that is running you. It is redundant and unnecessary it has outlived its usefulness. Amazing explanations!!

There are other paths, realizations and understandings so I understand what you are saying. Osho talks about this inclusion you describe and I am familiar with it as well. Also Osho warns about the cunningness of the ego and cautions about the understanding that the ego is also divine. My biggest concern would be the confusion that it can cause people. Could teaching this method do more damage than good. For example you might have to really work with someone close for them to understand this method. Especially if they have a very powerful sense of self(ego) What are your thoughts on this?

@ivankiss if you have personally deflated your ego and it doesn't run the show anymore that's great, but I wouldn't go around telling people to integrate their ego. You're going to confuse a lot of people and possibly do damage. The ego is a dysfunctional survival mechanism. You don't make the ego into an enemy or a friend, you just see it for what it is. It was there to keep you alive but in this day and age we need to start pulling the other direction towards Unity not individuality. When there is an actual cessation of the self structure in Samadhi there is no egoic, no self, no duality yet there is still the I am, annata or no self. In that emptiness is the dawn of prajna or wisdom- the understanding that the immanent self is far beyond the play of duality, beyond the entire continuum. The immanent self is timeless, unchanging, always now. The video I posted talks directly about that. Did you watch it? “Love is happy when it is able to give something. The ego is happy when it is able to take something.” Osho I honestly love how passionate you are about helping people. I'm here to help also. Thank you my friend ❤ ❤

This is a great video!!

Existence is as existence does that is the answer to why...

This it's a great understanding from Wayne Dyer of what the ego truly is.

Your ego is just trying to distract you bud. This is a classic example of the cunningness of the ego. Of course it wants you to integrate it, its purpose is survival. It doesn't want you to see it for what it truly is and be deflated. I think you may be trying to avoid going through the difficult task of dropping the false sense of self by simply saying everything is divine. Mind means the conditioning. The mind is greedy. Mind is greed. You drop this mind, and sannyas happens. A mechanical mind is an unconscious mind. The mind always thinks of doing something. All minds lead finally to misery, to suffering. Awareness is beyond time and beyond mind. Mind’s whole structure is based on confusion. Mind has no joy — it is really a wound, very painful. From mind to no-mind is the revolution of sannyas. Mind is confusion. Mind is never clear. It cannot be. mind is confusion; it is not that you are in confusion. Your mind is your misery, your mind is your bondage. The only security in existence is going beyond the mind. As a servant, mind is beautiful. As a master, it is a monster. Mind moves in time and consciousness lives in timelessness. Your mind is time. And when times ceases, your mind ceases. Mind is nothing but the process of the ego, the functioning of the ego. Meditation starts by being separate from the mind, by being a witness. Awareness is not of the mind, awareness is something beyond the mind. Meditation is the only magic that can help you to be free from the mind. To abandon the mind and to live life spontaneously is what I call sannyas. There is nothing like a silent mind. When silence is there, there is no mind. The mind has given nothing but misery, suffering, torture and nightmares. The ego, the calculating, cunning mind, is never compassionate, cannot be. Just be choiceless. Don’t choose. Choice brings the mind in. Choice is mind. You cannot predict a man who acts out of no-mind; only mind is predictable. You have to put mind aside to become a witness, and obviously mind resists it. Sannyas is real suicide, because it destroys the mind, it takes you beyond the mind. Mind is always mediocre, mind is never intelligent — it cannot be by its very nature. Meditation has nothing to do with mind; meditation simply means a state of no-mind. If you really want to be living at the maximum, don’t listen to the duality of the mind. When the mind stops there is no ego, when the mind is not functioning there is no ego. Mind is fear. Mind is a coward and is always concerned about security, safety, certainty. The mind is the by-product of fear, and because of the fear it goes on creating its own security. The death of the mind will be life for you, and the life of the mind is nothing but death for you. The mind has no inherent capacity for joy. The mind is the cause of all misery; it knows nothing of joy. Mind is constantly asking, desiring, demanding and creating frustration because it lives in expectations. Mind can never be happy. Mind is your accumulated discontent. Mind is your accumulated unhappy past. Bring more awareness to your mind, otherwise you are always on the verge of going mad, of becoming mad. Just remember that you are only a witness. The body is not you, the mind is not you. You are just a mirror. Existence never yields to any of our demands. It is the demanding mind that has been creating all our misery. Witness that you are not the body; witness that you are not the mind — this is the way to transcend body and mind. A mind that is not meditative is bound to suffer in every situation: riches, poverty, failure or success, it makes no difference. Mind never meets the truth, never encounters the truth. The ways of the mind and the ways of the truth are absolutely separate. Meditation is a state of no-mind. Meditation means the mind has stopped. Just you are, pure consciousness, simple awareness. Gautam Buddha has made it a meditation. He called it upeksha — indifference. Just be indifferent to the mind, and it won’t be a disturbance for long. Meditation is not a question of effort because all effort is going to be through the mind, of the mind, by the mind. How can it take you beyond the mind? The unknowable is not part of the mind. The unknowable is available to your being, to your consciousness, to the hidden sources of your life. Mind means dissatisfaction, mind means complaints, mind means unfulfilled greed, mind means incomplete desire. Mind is by its very nature a beggar. The mind lives through desires. The mind lives through greed, fear, jealousy, ambition. The mind distorts. Because of the motivations, the mind distorts. Our mind is very tricky and cunning: it always throws the responsibility on somebody, on something; it never takes the responsibility on itself. YOU are the cause of suffering. The day your mind is absolutely silent, with no disturbance, you have taken the first step that takes you to the temple of God. The temple of God is made of your consciousness. All knowledge is of the past. Mind is always of the past. Consciousness is always of the present. A buddha helps you to become more conscious; he does not help you to become more knowledgeable. The whole process of sannyas is getting rid of the mind. Mind consists of questions and answers. The moment you get rid of the mind, then only consciousness is left in its purity, with not even a ripple. It is your identification with thoughts that is creating the confusion: it brings you down into the mind; otherwise your watcher is far above it. And to get centered in your watching is the only way for peace. Your mind is never in the present, and time is always in the present; so time and mind never meet. This is the misery — that you are missing the train every moment; and you will go on missing your whole life. Meditation is simply going beyond mind, beyond the functioning of the mind, beyond all the fetters of the mind, and just entering into this silence, unmoving, unwavering — just a pure awareness, a silent flame, a great joy. Meditation is the state of no-mind. Not of a silent mind, not of a healthy mind, not of a concentrated mind, no. Meditation is the state of no-mind: no society within you, no conditioning within you. Just you, with your pure consciousness. When the mind no longer manipulates you, when the mind no longer controls you, when the mind is just a mechanism — if you need, you use it, otherwise you put it aside — you are free of the mind, you have attained your own masterhood. Use the mind, but don’t become it. Use it as you use other machines. Mind is a beautiful machine. If you can use it, it will serve you; if you cannot use it and it starts using you, it is destructive, it is dangerous. It is bound to take you into some trouble, into some calamity, into some suffering and misery, because a machine is a blind thing. It has no eyes, it has no insight. Mind cannot see; it can only go on repeating that which has been fed into it. It is like a computer; first you have to feed it. Hope this helps my friend ❤ ❤!!

He has such a loving energy!! Thanks 4 the share!

How and why would God imagine something like the ego which appears to have taken thousands of years to evolve into the dysfunctional survival mechanism that it is today and is responsible for almost all of the human suffering on the planet.

When you become empty of yourself you become full of the Divine... It's what's true ❤ ❤ love it!!