corndjorn

@Serotoninluv language is limited and you have to communicate it wrong sometimes anyway. and enlightenment is a thing, i think youre the one thats attached to concepts, more specifically nondual concepts. awakening to nonduality is one thing, and complete enlightenment is another thing. its an observable process in your limbic system that deepens the nondual state youre in, until there is no process or no anything at all, only until your subconcious mind is cleansed, can that be truthful to say.

@Leo Gura nonduality can often be an ideology or even energetic experience that many people think its nonduality too, paradoxically. just saying. the subconcious mind is a natural part of existence, a nondual person has no reason to cling to nondual concepts such as the nonexistence of things, nonduality is beyond existence and nonexistence.

@Leo Gura full enlightenment isnt really a fantasy since if there are degrees of depth of nonduality then there is a complete enlightenment, when all subconcious fears are released,that is considereed complete enlightenment. and yes i do know its a tall order, ive been stablized in nonduality for 4 years and have been doing mostly zen practices to embody the truth more deeply (releasing the subconcious fears). and i do agree with you that psychedelics can aid in many ways, as ive said energetic amplifiers have their benefits, but at a certain point in the path i feel like dealing with psychs is a bit like playing with fire, it can amplify blindspots and thus the process of dissolution becomes more rockier, depending on how well your foundation is of course.

@Serotoninluv you have a hand, if you self describe yourself as having a hand is that wrong? im awake to nonduality but not fully enlightened, doesnt go against nondual truth at all actually, its kinda paradoxical like that.

@Salvijus lol

@Leo Gura ive used psychedelics and benefited greatly from them, ive awoken to nonduality because of these substances and so i show my gratitude for that. However, many people including some gurus think that awakening and full enlightenment are synonomus with each other, when that couldnt be farther from the truth. Your limbic system has to catch up to the awakening by the slow process of dissolving subconcious fear mechanisms and attahcments running away from said fear mechanisms. Why i say at a certain point psychedelics are risky bussiness for a persons spiritual path is because the mere fact that the person is going through the process of dissolving attachments, goes against what many people do which is the subconcious chase of nondual experiences through psychedelics. now there isnt anything wrong with that for seeking purposes, but once awakened and you stabilize for a while psychedelics become more pointless ime and other peoples experience that ive talked to. energetic amplifiers have so much benefit im not denying that, but we are humans and we have egoic blindspots, and giving those blindspots an energetic amplifier will only make your process to enlightenment more rocky or more likely too. you can still use it as a tool sure, but based on what ive said i think its a flawed tool at a certain point, and there are more conductive ways of going through your spiritual process.

@Serotoninluv i am aware, my whole process is to disidentify and dissolve attachments and their underlying fear mechanisms, though i do have blindspots ofc because im not fully enlightened, thank you for your heads up though.

@Enlightenment yes, enlightenment is not an easy ordeal, its a process that takes time and patience. awakening to nonduality is the easy part, removing the delusional thorns from your subconcious is the hard part. look up shunryu zen master, he has work that talks about this.

@Salvijus ive watched it, but please read what ive said more carefully please. the mere raw energy of bragging, even if its in a joking manner, still comes from subconcious self esteem issues, which is not synonomous with enlightenment. i suggest reading shunryu's work, he has stuff that explains this.

@Salvijus any egoic energy present in the system of a person shows that the person isnt fully enlightened, even if hes just joking. sadhguru is in a deep nondual state but i dont consider him to be fully enlightened. the mere fact that he brags about himself show that he have subconcious self esteem issues, a psychology major would even know that.

@Nahm no problem. a person awake to nonduality shouldnt feel wrong about talking about progress, its a natural part of this life were living, and awakening to the beyond is something benefecial indeed and is tied to enlightenment but isnt full enlightenment for the mere fact that all youre life youve been putting memory after memory of fear driven delusion in your subconcious mind, and fear and nonduality are not congruent as a result, fear and the egoic paradigm it drives, dissolves in the face of true nonduality.

@Consilience ive said psychedelics CAN blunt spiritual progress not WILL. i dont think you read my post well tbh.

all that you described is awakening, NOT enlightenment. Enlightenment is a very real thing. enlightenment is when your limbic sytem catches up with the awakening and clears all subconcious fears and the attachments that try running away from. many people that just awoke to nonduality think that thats it, but they couldnt be farther from the truth, their reality will start to crumble because all their egoic paradigms will slowly be released, which can hurt. since fear is not synonomous with enlightenment, dont convince yourself your enlightened when youre not, youre just awakened to nonduality, there millions that are, but very few that are fully enlightened.

@Matt8800 as ive said in the post, psychedelics are good tools for awakenings but NOT full enlightenment. ive had my first nondual awakening through psychs and i thank their purpose in my path, but at a certain point once youve been stabilized in nonduality sober for many years, youll see that the subconcious need for psychedelic or mystical experiences is just another attachment to be dropped, extreme and fancy experiences will never get you to enlightenment, only give u a fancy awakening. but full enlightenment is a slow delicate process of your limbic system catching up with the awakening.

@Nahm awakening to nonduality is one thing, ive been in nonduality for 4 years without psychs (though awakened by psychs). and the process that your limbic system undergoes after the awakening is a whole nother thing. this is what seperates a zen master and a random dude on a forum who just convinces himself that he has no fear anymore because he just awoke to nonduality. one is humble enough to realize that his subconcious mind is going through a process of cleansing fear mechanisms, the other wants to hold on to the truth of nonduality and not look at the reality of the process.

@thesmileyone one person actually cleared many of his fear mechanisms, another person just tells himself that he has no fear, or maybe the few humble enough to realize that they are undergoing a process after the awakening.

@Aquarius ive said they are tools in the post, but im saying if youd like to advance in the spiritual path, you cannot be using psychedelics as a conductive tool anymore at a certain point, the mere subconcious need for mystical or cool experiences for it comes from attachment and thus underlying fear mechanisms, a person in nonduality has no need for a psychedelic experience and would in fact blunt the process that their system is going through. its a good tool as a starting spiritual tool like i said, as it helped me alot aswell, and it awoke me to nonduality, but psych experiences are perverted by many emotions that are amplified, and as humans we should be humble enough to realize that we have blindspots, and giving our blindspots an energetic amplifier is a bad idea, especially if you are on the path. but some tools are more conductive than others. would you use a fancy looking hammer to build your house or would you use a hammer thats most conductive to building the house? you can choose whatever hammer you want at the end of the day, but like i said, at a certain point in the path psychedelic use is not conductive for full enlightenment. and enlightenment is not a tool... tool for what exactly? enlightenment is the clearing of all fear mechanisms and their attachments, basically all of your ego, its not something your ego can take advantage of. some people mistake awakening as enlightenment when that couldnt be farther from the truth. enlightenment is when your limbic system catches up with your awakening, by clearing all subconcious energetic contractions. also your post makes alot of condescending assumptions/projections, i dont appreciate that.

@Nahm man you saying that is like telling a person with schizophrenic disorder that its all bullshit, its condecending as fuck and you aint really reading what hes saying, my friends went through hell and wrecked their lives because of misuse of kriya and kundalini practices, this shit shouldnt be taken lightly. its like telling a dude on psych mania thats its all bullshit. cmon man i think you know better than that. kundalini syndrome is a real physical thing that can happen to people.

@Recursoinominado you are right, didnt notice some of the stuff you wrote earlier, glad we are on the same page.

@Recursoinominado my whole point was to put yourself in his place. a person experiencing 12 years of extreme kundalini side effects takes much more than just surrender, the kundalini master has to assist him, with people not everything works the same as it works for you. even gurus agree that some people need much more than nondual pointers or concepts of surrender or speaking to a higher self, alot of shadow integration is needed but also energetic assistance from the kundalini master aswell. its not that your surrender advice is wrong its actually good but imo its not the thing thats most relevant to him for the time being, energetic assistance is needed from a professional kundalini master, 12 years of intense kundalini syndrome is not normal. sorry if i came a bit abrasive btw, its just that my friends had problems with this that couldve been dealt much more earlier.

@Arhattobe hehe thanks man

@Recursoinominado tell a person with borderline personality disorder to surrender, not gonna happen so easily my friend, not everyone is on the same level playing field concerning their energetic contractions. sorry but seems like you havent had much experience with other peoples kundalini experiences, i had people get fucked over messing around with kundalini energy when they werent ready for it or just plain out not their right path. energetic manipulation is no funny bussiness, it can seriously wreck some peoples lives. should be taken with caution. alot of peoples energetic system cannot deal with this type of energy, you speak from your reference point alot but deny the fact that many people dont "surrender" as easily as you think. Ive been stable in nonduality for many years so i dont have to awaken my kundalini, and hate to burst your bubble but any emotional/mental formations within consciousness is considered ultimately delusional, including your communication with your "higher self" or your conception of god, and synchronisties, it is just another attachment to be dropped.

@tedens side effect of what? im sorry i dont know exactly what youre talking about.

@tedens Pardon?

@Rilles yep, hes a pretty cool teacher, though i suggest you read or listen to shunryu zen master if youd like, i believe he has much more depth than most teachers.