Paul92

@Serotoninluv Thanks for that. I enjoyed reading that. It seems like it is really working for you, so I can't knock that at all. I'd love to get into a similar place, considering where I am right now. I just don't really know where to start, and I'm not sure what progress would even look like. I have pretty much the same environment, too. So that should be helpful. Just feel lost at the moment though and it's hard to see a way out. I feel/think/believe I have seen through an illusion that I can't unsee. The only issue is, I loved that world beyond words. It's hard to give it up. Anyway, hijacked the thread. My apologies.

@Serotoninluv I was never a huge thinker until I came across nonduality or the 'new age' etc. My issue is that, I really don't have anyone to discuss things with, that I can trust. My father is on his own path, but while he preaches everything that a spiritual path seems to dictate, he does it in a very forceful and aggressive way. Which seems quite absurd to me. He's not got a lot of patience. I phoned him this week to come and see me (I've never done that in my life). I spilled out everything. Told him I was suicidal etc. He didn't seem to take me that serious and got quite aggressive. What he was saying might make sense to a lot of people here, but if anything, I think looking at it now, it has pushed a wedge between us. Would you say you identify with yourself today? Like, do you feel that person you always thought you was is still sat within your head? Or are you 'vacant', for want of a better word...

@Serotoninluv I'm glad that worked for you and you have found peace. Hand on heart, very happy for you. I know what you mean about thought stories. My mind just can't let it go though.

@Serotoninluv Hmmm. But surely, more than anything, we know who we are? You can identify with yourself better than anything. What you are like. What your traits are. What makes you happy. What makes you sad. We just know this, don't we? I can see that it is absolutely nothing material. It can't be. Maybe it is a soul. Maybe it is. I just don't think you can rid yourself of 'you'. It's madness. It's an impossible task.

I really don't think anyone understands. @SgtPepper Of course I don't. But on the flip side of that, I simply do not see a way that I can ever feel normal again or have my own life back. It's impossible and that is all I want. To feel like I used to. To feel like Paul. And for me to see my loved ones as my loved ones. To have MY life. I was always comfortable in my skin as 'Paul'. I had my faults but I was always the first to put my hand up and admit that. I tried to live an honest and decent life causing nobody any harm. I never had to work to be something, I was just who I was and I was happy with that. Now everyone here is saying we have to destroy our sense of identity. There is no me and there is no you. We are all one. Controlled by something else. Destroy the Self. And you can say this is all a belief. This is all a thought. Well, yes it is, but does that make it any less true? If all thoughts and beliefs are false, then why are we all on this forum stating our thoughts and beliefs about whatever this is? If we are not our thoughts, how did we ever reach the conclusions that many have reached here? If I could just be Paul, and look after myself, and be that person, knowing that that was the truth, then I'd be happy enough. But there is no Paul, is there? So, ultimately, I don't want to be here. Waking up this morning there was just an intense dread. There is no colour left. I'm sick of waking up in the morning knowing that today I must grind away at myself. I must destroy my identity. I must become nothing. Lose attachment to everything. ANd just 'be'. Be happy staring the walls in my house. Not having any opinions. Not having any goals. Just metabolizing air. And you can say this is ego backlash or whatever. But at least as an ego, I experienced happiness. I experienced love and compassion to others. Now I'm supposed to destroy Paul and just be content that everything is already perfect. I'm tired of the word salads. I'm tired of the hypocrisy. I'm tired of the you are and individual, but you aren't, we are one. I'm tired of the empty is full and full is empty. Everything is nothing and nothing is everything. Truth is, it makes no difference whether I throw myself off a bridge later today. And a lot of you are thinking that. Because there is no me. I never existed in the first place. It'll all just go dark and that it is it. Nothing scary about that is there? Oh but what about the people you care about. Hang about, 5 minutes ago everyone was saying that nobody exists. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS. So fuck it. Why not.

@Dust2Life Thanks for your comment. I play in a band. Have done since I was around 14. I love playing live. Problem is, I don't know who I am right now, or who anyone else is, nevermind what my future self would look like. And according to everyone on here, we're not even in control of 'us'. Which seems to be backed up by science, weirdly enough. @Serotoninluv Believing I was an independent individual living on a lovely planet was good enough for me. It was blissful. Now, clearly my thoughts are not my own, so where are they coming from? And why? Why are we allowed to identify with out thoughts? Oh I dare say it is lovely. I've just no idea how it is even possible. And why aren't we already there? Why isn't it a natural state?

It's tough guys, it really is. How can I go from having a lust for life to this. I just don't understand. I don't want to be God. I was me to be me, and you to be you. So life is precious but we make the best of it. I want us to have free will. Who created God? It just doesn't seem right. I spent the afternoon just fiddling about with some old guitars of mine. I loved playing my guitar. I love music. Now I just don't see the point. I kept just thinking why delay the inevitable. Just end it now. Where is the bliss in not exploring the world and just doing nothing? Where's the bliss in everything being the same thing? I just don't get it. I really don't.

Do we have free will?

@mandyjw I don't even know who 'myself' is though!! Is it Paul, but just the 'real' Paul. Or is no Paul, and something else Paul doesn't know? My body is not my body. It never was, it never will be. Purple and some blues.

@Joseph Maynor So what is it that says the ego is false?

@Dust2Life Sorry to hear you're struggling. I'm just getting to the point where I feel nothing is preferable to whatever this is. @Fortunate Son I'm really sorry to hear that. But I'm glad you're in a stable place now. I just can't see how I will ever get my old life back. It simply can't be done. This nondual stuff has shattered my life. Is it even my life? Issues of free will etc... I just don't think we have it. I've sat down today several times and really contemplated ending it all. I've even set it up. My mind wanted to but my body wouldn't do it. Maybe tomorrow, who knows.

@David Hammond You're suggesting I just focus on my breathe in everything that I do? Always?

@David Hammond I'm never going to get that experience though. It's clear to me that the world is not everything that I thought it was. And that's hard. I can sit looking at a tree all day, trying to clear my mind and saying that I don't understand what it is, but what will that do? Basically you're saying be comfortable with not really knowing anything. I suppose that is possible, but what is the motivation for anything? When I could just say you know what, I've had a good run, had some wonderful experiences with some things I thought were wonderful people, but fuck it, call it a day. Why delay the inevitable. I want to die. Simply as that. It's just doing it.

@Shiva I struggle to see how you can love an illusion. Wouldn't that be loving your ego too? All this would suggest that the goal is not ego death, which is contrary to all of this. It makes no sense. If I love someone, I love their personality, their traits, their humour, their views and opinions on life, their skills etc. Take this away and there is nothing. Nothing to love. @David Hammond Yes, but then in the next breathe you will be saying that the self is an illusion and not 'you'. It makes zero sense. I know the self is an illusion. The ego is nonsense. But it is all we have.

@David Hammond I think I have. There is no you, there is no me. So how can there be individuals. Makes zero sense.

@Jkris Again, that makes zero sense. You have no explained at all why my understanding is wrong. Everything I have said is exactly how everyone here is trying to understand it. This is not about a breakup.

@David Hammond I'm afraid that makes zero sense. There is no you or me. The only you or me that exists is the ego you or me. Which is not a thing.

@David Hammond So why do egoless animals prey on other animals? That natural world is very vicious.

All I'll say is I know what you mean. One person says there is no self and you need to work to get rid of your ego. And the other sayings destroying the ego is egoic. Sadhguru seems to take a more human approach. He says there is only one person in the body, which is you. But then says we are all one. I find it incredibly confusing the same and don't know which way to turn.

@Angelo John Gage Just on your rollercoaster thing... so you say we have freedom to look around. So you sit there and you will think "I will look around". Where did that thought come from? You could not think that thought before you thought it!

Interesting video. What I always get confused about though is the illusion of free will. We have a choice to believe in nonduality etc. We have a choice to identify with our mind etc. There's good evidence to suggest that we simply do not have free will. Which also makes sense with what you're saying. Everything just happens. So how much influence do we actually have? Think of any thing. Anything at all. An object anything. Where did that thought come from? You can't think a thought before you have thought it...

I know understand there is no 'me' or 'you'. It's pretty obvious. Which is hard for this body/mind, or whatever it is, to process. I'm in a complete meltdown again, and I've been looking for a way out. My doctor put me on anti depressants and I started taking them a few days ago and the anxiety and suicidal thoughts have just gone through the roof. I was always someone who thrived off our individuality. On us being separate entities. I have said before I loved helping other people, because I wanted to make a difference to their absolute unique experience. Knowing that we can't possible be individuals, even though we feel like it, takes a lot of colour out of this existence, from this perspective. I think I have to start the 'path'. Because it is the only hope I have left to enjoy whatever this is and not suffer. I am tired of suffering (though, before I realised the truth, I can't say I suffered as much) But my greatest realisation, above everything, is that there is no 'me'. Which, as I say, takes the colour out of the experience. Others on here might say that it makes the experience lighter, but at the moment, that is not how it seems for me. So what do I have to do? I try and be present but it is unbelievably difficult. Is this where I start? Can anyone help me, please? My ego heart is broken at the moment, as I ballsed up a relationship with a girl. After I realised that basically, I was falling for something that isn't real. But the pain is real. The thought of her with someone else is devastating, even though I know, it's not real! Please, I really need help. I have a lot of questions.

@mandyjw I don't know if it is. I don't even know who she is. Whether she is real or not. I don't even know if I'm real. I don't think I am. I can't even tell you how I feel at the moment. Completely and utterly hopeless. My entire world has come crashing down. Don't even know where to start. I don't know what to believe or what to do. Just completely lost and broken.

Thoughts on this, please... Is he right? I suppose if you resist your feelings that will be suffering..

@zambize Thank you. It's difficult to draw the line isn't it. The point where, yes, I feel like I miss someone and it makes me sad. You might say I could just observe those feelings. Do I observe or do I embrace? Observation is distancing, to me.