Arhattobe

Enlightenment. Spirituality. Both are misunderstood things. Being in a constant mystical state. Becoming aware of a dimension of life beyond the sense. Both are nowadays synonymous with enlightenment. I myself awakened more than a few years ago, and when I was stable in that new state that then was beyond my reference point and understanding. When my insights and teachings of teachers matched up I thought. Yes. I’m there. Then like most other teachers and people who awakened. I played a multitude of mind games, and escapist tactics to pretend like I’m a Buddha. After a multitude of extreme shifts afterwards. I became aware that life, reality and dharma had much more to teach than a simple “recognition”. & even that recognition varies. Ramana Maharshi, and a random guy who awakens on here might both become aware of an aspect of life, but their degree of “understanding” is extremely different. I’ll use an example. Let’s take a concept like love. A child that loves his mom, and a 50 year old with grown child have different understandings of love. Nuanced, more subtle yet much deeper perspective exists in ramana. In fact Ramana himself isn’t fully enlightened, but my reasoning for that, and the fact itself are irrelevant and will cause nothing but a series of pointless arguments. I said it just to catch your attention a bit lol. I know more than you. Make use of me. I’m here to help. Ask me anything

@outlandish Thought activity is multi layered. This is an oversimplification but will do for this response. The top layer: Gross thoughts, inner dialogue, conscious fantasies or where you “think out loud.” This surface layer, however is like the tip of an iceberg. All the activity in the top layer is due to hundreds of layers of subtle activity, some of which you may be semi conscious of (the background chatter,) and many that you are unconscious of. Eg primal thoughts, self defence mechanisms, muscle memory, and modes of being eg fear of the unknown. One can have a quiet top most layer of mind, in a non dual state. As I had been in the past, but yet still have massive traumas influencing every act, and every action. Such a state might seem thoughtless, some might seem it Sahaja samadhi, but in reality you are simply unconscious of what is motivating you. Numb, very perfectly clear. Now in regards to me, and your question. The top most layer, the background noise layers are empty. Yet there are undoubtably layers that I am unconscious of that keep me from “complete enlightenment”. Arhatship. I know this because they fall away, and my experience changes dramatically because of them.

Mystical states, and non dual awareness by themselves do not mean much. You can have horrific experiences, depression and be an all around dick while experiencing both. You can also be way more deluded than the average “dualistic” person. People’s scope of spirituality, and understanding of enlightenment is extremely limited, and to some they will discover with great pain how delusional they are one day. This is why the Buddhists said the dharma will be lost in the future, because the teachers you look up to. The belief systems you’ve created, disguised as beliefs beyond beliefs, are one dimensional and for lack of a better term just as false as your previous belief systems. It’s quite sad. Yet partly our fault for denying our humanity and seeking escapism instead of growth. If you are in such a state. Move on, and you might actually grow towards a more nuanced perspective of life.

I’ll post the relevant part of the sutta called ”Brahma-nimantanika Sutta” and then expand upon it. The Blessed One said: "On one occasion recently I was staying in Ukkattha in the Subhaga forest at the root of a royal sala tree. Now on that occasion an evil viewpoint had arisen to Baka-Brahma: 'This is constant. This is permanent. This is eternal. This is total. This is not subject to falling away — for this does not take birth, does not age, does not die, does not fall away, does not reappear.[1]And there is no other, higher escape.' "So I — having known with my awareness the train of thought in Baka Brahma's awareness — as a strong man would extend his flexed arm or flex his extended arm, vanished into the root of the royal sala tree in the Subhaga forest in Ukkattha and appeared in that brahma world. Baka Brahma saw me coming in the distance and, on seeing me, said, 'Come, good sir. You are well-come, good sir. It has been long, good sir, since you arranged to come here — for this, good sir, is constant. This is permanent. This is eternal. This is total. This is not subject to falling away — for here one does not take birth, does not age, does not die, does not fall away, does not reappear. And there is no other, higher escape.' "When this was said, I told Baka Brahma, 'How immersed in ignorance is Baka Brahma! How immersed in ignorance is Baka Brahma! — in that what is actually inconstant he calls "constant." What is actually impermanent he calls "permanent." What is actually non-eternal he calls "eternal." What is actually partial he calls "total." What is actually subject to falling away he calls "not subject to falling away." Where one takes birth, ages, dies, falls away, and reappears, he says, "For here one does not take birth, does not age, does not die, does not fall away, does not reappear." And there being another, higher escape, he says, "There is no other, higher escape."' The 10 fetters of Buddhism exist in all who are not yet awakened. Awakening merely gets rid of the first. Body identification. However, with the body identification seen through. As long as one’s fetters and karmic body remain. Whether one is in an awakened state or not. The energies of most awakened is still tethered to the body. The denial of this is as the Buddha said an “evil viewpoint”, a product of mara. The ego. Attempting to escape what it is clearly bound by. Pretending one has graduated from Harvard when one is in elementary school. Worse are those with half baked glimpses saying the same thing when they aren’t even awake. Mere talking points and belief systems that deny being beliefs. A individuated man, trapped in body identification denying his reality. This sort of delusion is not a good foundation for growth. This sort of self deceit will slow down one’s progress. Awakening is good, but karmic annihilation of all tendencies, of all that tethers is to a body to an individual, who may or may not experience non duality is the point of the true path. The pure dharma. That comes about with a holistic approach. The 8 fold noble path. Seek growth, not escape. Seek to learn not to display knowledge or to teach. Good luck

@StephenK Certainly not an arhat. Arhat to be doesn’t mean I am but (hopefully) will be. Ones facial expression, facial tension and overall look communicates the level of karmic tension in one’s body. As you progress and get to higher states the tension level of people or lack thereof becomes noticable. I do not know Daniel Ingram, but based on that he certainly seems like he has a long way to go. People that claim to be arhats are completely clueless to how much karmic baggage they have and how “deep the rabbit hole goes”. I have not seen a single teacher in modernity I would consider an arhat. The closest people would be Master sheng yen, Ramana, Suzuki. Based on physical tension and energy reading. I do not actively do any sort of practice, but do recommend vipassana. In regards to self inquiry it is active and thought based its pointless. With that line of inquiry or the understanding you have of it in the back of your mind. Meditating can be fruitful though. Book wise : Oshos pathless path is a good for those not awake/beginners, but I recommend a more holistic approach once you are actually on the path. Check out accesstoinsight.org and their summary of the Theravada path for that @WindInTheLeaf Your intellect is running amok thinking it’s going to get somewhere meaningful. It will not.

@outlandish Yes. Mooji was more helpful to me to awaken that people way beyond him, but again his teachings are one dimensional, filled with falsehoods and etc. Theravada is the most advanced meaning It touches upon all aspects of life. Realms of experience. Traps. Stages, and nuances that aren’t touched upon in any teaching. Within theravada I recommend the sutta pitaka. I will make a thread and post relevant suttas there later. @WindInTheLeaf Your thought pattern and reasoning is kind of incoherent and all over the place. Sorry. I don’t understand your point.

@outlandish Hindu based traditions : Too many too count. All over the place. No complete, consistent, coherent body of teaching or lineage. None have a full picture understanding. Most are one dimensional. Has been perverted over time. Abrahamic religions : limited by the god concept who is an external humanised authority figure, cultural nonesense, perversion over time. Sikh tradition : Limited by the god concept, and it’s view of god. That is closer to truth than all other god centered traditions. That leaves Jainism and Buddhism. Jainism is pretty good, pretty closish to theravada Buddhism but illogical at times and inferior to a degree than Buddhism. That leaves Buddhism: which was split up into Theravada and Mahayana Mahayana then gave birth to chan (zen) and Vajrayana (which gave birth to Tibetan Buddhism.) Vajrayana and the parts of mahayana it was birthed out of focus to much on mind phenomenon, Siddhis, heaven realms, devas and light bodies and due to that suffers from not being as direct. With most practitioners getting too caught up in phenomenon with they enter high levelled mystical states. Chan, and Zen Buddhism focus too much on awakening, and lack nuance. Theravada is the most consistent body of teaching, the oldest, least perverted and most nuanced:)

@aclokay UG shouldn’t be a role model. The man rejects his humanity as well and is very angry. A sad sight to look at.

@CreamCat No. If a child with cancer call you something you won’t be hurt because you see their hurt. They are acting out in pain. In the beginning you don’t feel that even if you know it intellectually, but then you feel and your intellect doesn’t play a role anymore. @WindInTheLeaf Karma is released gradually because lessons need to be learned, shift in to non dual states or higher states can be representative of milestones, and can lead to faster karmic burn rates but won’t rid you of all your karma. You can awaken, and then through wrong actions start gaining a ton of karma though. Not sure if I understood your question correctly though.

@Mu_ Yes. I can feel energies to a degree, based on that, and me comparing recorded vs live ones. That became rather clear to me:)

The intellect is not the problem. The problem is as the intellect attempts to understand it creates a lot of garbage “karma” as a byproduct. When the intellect is cleansed. It will remain functional without gunk.

Non live video recordings dramatically decrease the level of energetic transfer, and might even pollute them to a decent degree. The more you know. Lol.

Sounds dramatic. Your scenario, but things happen as they should. Will expand on that in a future thread maybe:)

@SageModeAustin I am so sorry to hear that Austin. If you ever want to talk. Let me know. It won’t help much, but I can listen if no one else does. I myself suffered from long stretches of depression and dark nights. Sorry it has to be this way. I am not sure about the affects of stimulants and how in need of them you might or might not be so I will try to stay away from that topic. I will, however, say that the lessons are learned and over when dharma says it over. Not when we have had enough. Have faith. Hang in there. Wish you the best. @outlandish 28, and I wouldn’t consider myself as either layperson or monk. Just a person committed to growing, seeing more clearly and understanding the dharma. In regards to my lifestyle. I am studying for my second masters degree and am currently in a relationship with a good woman who I dearly love and care for. @TheAvatarState Sorry but I’d rather not persue this line of thinking any further. Do not think it’s productive.

Accessing certain energies consciously or unconsciously, and vulnerabilities in one’s system can allow for such experiences. If they are spiritual, and not psychological. For someone in your positions. I’d advise against things that can make your system more vulnerable. Eg introduction extreme amounts of energy to your system via psychedelics. Stay away from occult practices, and esoteric “knowledge”, and try to heal your system via healthy eating and excercising. Gl

@Preetom I’ll try to answer all of your questions in one response. As I said due to the conflict created due to the intellects functional need to survive through knowledge vs the inherent limitations imposed upon it. Fear is created. In response to fear karmic conditionings are created. Most of these karmic patterns aim to battle the primal fear that rests in the deep reecesses of our subconscious by gaining control. Most of unnatural cravings are based in this battle for control. Control in this context can mean. Looking good in front of others, getting a good job, becoming enlightened, pretending to know stuff, because in one’s perception each one of those examples mitigate and control the number of fearful scenarios that can arise. Natural desires are desires that are not based in such karmic conditionings.

@TheAvatarState well, that’s is what I meant . But I’ll attempt to answer your question even though I don’t necessarily agree with a lot of your assumptions. I am not too familiar with the ox map, but I’ll try to make sense of it the best I can. Humor mostly targets negativity, and shows us the stupidity of negativity in a new way. A way that can make us laugh at ourselves, others, culture or world. When an Average person engages in humor. They automatically attack and disenfranchise some people. Groups that are the butt of the joke. Groups that are looked down upon. A fully enlightened being will do no such thing, however. He will target no one, and his smile will be pure genuinity. This will warm the hearts of those around him:) @tsuki 1- They become perceivable as your progress. As your awareness reaches deeper and deeper levels, and as more and more karma comes up to be processed. 2- In regards to the types, names and taxonomies of karma. They exist. The 7 chakras and other energy centres for example store different types of karma. I will make a thread on karma at a later point to explain the different types of karma and etc. If people are interested:) rather not get into now though. Lot needs to be explained. 3- Awakenings can help clear some karma. So does the path on average. The 8 fold path is a good systemic approach on how to burn karma instead of acruing it:)

@tsuki Np. 1- Awakening. Is becoming aware of the ground of existence. Becoming aware of the ground, however. Happens through a human system. Therefor this newfound “awareness” and its depth are limited to your systems level of gunk. Karma, and garbage. When awakening happens most folks on the surface level of their system. Conscious self referencing level realise the “truth” yet there are countless underlying, and subconscious layers of one’s system. That due to readings eg need to survive will not follow suit. Ones karmic life on a deeper level which is also “self referencing”, albeit it not on the gross thought level will continue. Most people at this stage deny the underlying layers. Denial of the uncomfortable truths of life and one’s karmic life become much easier once the surface level is freed up. 2- Everything in existence communicates something, a reality. From gross objects to more abstract realities like cultures and ideas. What they communicate can interact with your system and cause a specific type of karma, but they do not store karma like human systems. In short, in a way, yes, and in a way no. 3- Karma goes much deeper than what the term “ego” represents nowadays. That is why I make the distinction.

@Mu_ This is part of what I mean by nuance. Realising the self is one thing. The implications, and conclusions one comes to from that, and how that realisation is filtered, and perverted through the intellect and karmic body is another. The self strives for growth, if it isn’t doing so. It is in delusion, it is attempting to escape, going against its directive and/or dharma. Just as a serial killer has a lot of room for growth so does an awakened person, and if you think serial killers don’t have a lot of room for growth. As if them being the “self” negates the reality of their suffering and need to grow. Then we have a big issue on our hands .@TheAvatarState Odd question. Sorry, but I don’t see the relevance of the question on the path. Please ask a more relevant one. @tsuki Through the creation of the intellect or through consuming the fruits of the tree of knowledge. Man falls from heaven. Meaning through the creation of the intellect. Man becomes self aware, it tries to learn, to know, and to use its knowledge to survive. Yet man can not know enough, learn enough, and it’s survival is always being threatened. This conflict gives birth to the base of one’s karmic body. Fear. Upon that primal fear all other self defence mechanisms (pieces of karma) are built. In short. Karma = The byproduct of the intellect’s conflict with itself. @SageModeAustin A dark night of the soul happens because parts of ourselves, life or others that we looked away from. Need to come up to be seen. During a dark night we can no longer look away. Once we look directly into what needs to be seen, and learn all we need to learn from it. It passes. In case it is caused by a systemic issue, I recommend trying to eat healthy, excercising, and avoiding stimulants and psychedelics. Let life teach you for while. It will if you listen <3 Good luck

1- I don’t have a guide line per say, I’ll try to come up with one that captures everything I was want to communicate, but kind of tired now lol. 2- I do understand why you would be curious. Understand your perspective, but will choose not to engage this line of inquiry because like I said it will not be productive. I’m regards to your problems with your perfectionists problems. Sorry to hear that. That’s why nuance is important.

@Mafortu <3

@Mu_ Sorry, but can you reiterate what your question is in a more clear manner. Your questions aren’t connected and I’m not sure which one to respond to.

@Mu_ I hope you don’t mind but I’ll kind of skip your first two questions. Engaging them won’t be productive regardless of what my reply will be. In regards to your third question. I want people to understand that a lack of nuance, genuineness, self honesty and self awareness may lead to darker holes than some crawled out of. It can be very damaging. Pre and post awakening. Also sharing what I know and my perspective so people can have a nuanced and healthy perspective instead of a dogmatic, escapist one. @Hellspeed Sorry, but can you be more clear. If your asking me if I can’t heal any disease. The answer is no.

@Hellspeed ?

I do not have a website. If you want my opinion on something ask me, and I will answer.