Joshe

Life demands our engagement and it demands more from some than others. You're lucky not to be one who it demands little from. The greater the trial, the greater the victory. You persist because it’s how you become fit for greater advancement. You weather the storms up this fucked up hill we call life and you will be made strong by it. That strength is your reward, and you will be glad you earned it. Challenge God to drop it all on you. Do his worst. There's nothing God can do to break you. BEG for it. Stand in defiance and refuse to be torn down. You will break. You will cry. But you will persist and in the end, you will arrive at peace and you will see the hill was intentional. Gather the will to make it up the hill. The hill is much easier to climb if you remove unhappiness and add happiness. These are two different things. Start by eliminating as much unhappiness and stress as you can, which include addressing the basics: improve your sleep, fine-tune your diet, and get regular exercise. Also, identify and reduce sources of stress, which can be tricky, for example, I loved playing speed chess, but it was making my heart race and spiking my adrenaline 20+ times per day, which I enjoyed, but it wasn't serving me, even though I thought it was. Add happiness by figuring out what you actually enjoy that is healthy, and make sure you give yourself some of that. Meanwhile, build your vision. You've been given an opportunity to make something of this thing and to see what you can turn it into. No pressure, no diamonds. Self-direction audio clip: https://recorder.google.com/ebd0c7bc-ff59-428e-a6d8-c0ec3c214990 The evolutionary law audio clip - https://recorder.google.com/e24eb57b-b9ce-4b04-bf98-32481df98027

The first death post triggered mine, the second one you’re referring to. Maybe the first two triggered this one.

I'm trying to realize it but I can't. There is literally only one thing I condemn like this. It's mass deception. First it was it was Trump, now it's Trump and Elon, but ONLY because people are deceived. If people weren't deceived, I wouldn't care about Trump or Elon. I don't have any other political gripes besides this. Not even sure you can call it political. Given this, you still feel confident I'm stuck in green?

But in reality, they do, and Elon exploits it. I don't like that exploitation. It seems like you're saying you're aware of the exploitation I'm aware of, but it doesn't bother you the same way it bothers me. Is that right? @Leo Gura Can you explain? I am defending what I think is true. I care about truth in the sense that I believe it's how to stamp out evil. I don't hate evil. I hate falsehood because evil can't exist without falsehood. Once evil is here, I understand it is here. Which is why I don't hate Musk. I hate the believed falsehood. I'm not out here demonizing Musk's pollution stacks or flipping out about Gaza. I'm trying to figure out if there might be some of what you say is in me but I'm not sure if you've read me accurately. Obviously I respect your opinion and will seriously consider what you say but I want to make sure you aren't painting me into green sjw box that I don't think I belong in. Edit: If people didn't fall for the Musk propaganda, I would pay no mind to Musk. The only reason he's worth calling out is the same reason Trump is worth calling out. Because when there's mass falsehood and deception being spread, it doesn't sit right with me. And I will protest that like a SJW. But nothing else.

Do you not value anything? Why be unbiased? You can choose your biases. I don't know enough about you to put you into a box...yet, but I'm learning! Like you said, if the left just so happens to be right on this, so be it. Also, the thing I dislike most about Elon is not Elon. It's the lie that he's benevolent. I appreciate that. And thanks for letting me probe your intelligence and putting up with me. Honestly, when looking at some of his videos, something about him makes me feel sad and I feel sorry for him. So I totally recognize he's a human doing the best he can but I also recognize he's highly narcissistic and he goes out of his way to spread the message that he's benevolent. I'm not going to just conjure up the sad videos and ignore what he's done with Twitter, how he supports Trump, his regular attitude, his record of deception, and most importantly, his ongoing brand-awareness campaign to paint himself as a benevolent genius. These things do not point to benevolence. What really gives me confidence in my read is that I know he wants people to think that. When a narcissist billionaire wants people to think that and then floods the zone with that sentiment and people start believing it, that's what I have a problem with. If he has to deceive to be seen as benevolent, that removes him from my definition of benevolent.

@aurum Thanks for responding. I agree to some extent with much of what you said but much of it is too simplistic and some of it is pure fallacy. For example: My shortcut/heuristic attempts to track and keep count of deceptions for use as a tool to navigate reality. The process is certainly fallible. I don't know with 100% certainty and neither do you. The difference is, I'm confident in my reads and you're not. You see my confidence as bias and your yielding of judgement as wisdom, but what if I told you that my confidence is not bias and your yielding is not wise? You can point to margin of error as reason to not judge reality but this collapses quickly. I hope you'll unpack this very sneaky, likely unconscious, tactic you're using here. I can see it being wise to yield your judgements if you want to be in a passive relationship to reality. But I don't think it's wise to be in the midst of reality and making claims about it without attempting to discern what is true about it. As you mentioned, the intricacies of reality do not lend themselves to true/false boolean assignments. You're right. The disagreement is this: I have dealt with your position but you have not dealt with mine. I acknowledge these How much good Elon has produced for humanity. I'm fully on board that he's most likely a net positive for humanity and has brought immense value. I'm not saying he's a piece of shit, although he is, but I am not saying anything like that. OMIT THAT. I'm not saying he shouldn't exist I'm not saying he is fully selfish, I know he's human. I'm aware that everyone has in them the innocence of the child. I'm not new to consciousness work. Also, I am not a leftist and I don't have a leftist agenda against him. If you stop painting me into whatever box you're painting me, maybe you can see what I'm trying to say. I will attempt once more: If you recognize 10 instances of Musk flat out bullshitting, and you say: What do you do with those judgements? It seems to me you simply say "he's human, just like the rest of us. he has good qualities too", and that's the extent of what you do with it. Notice how you might pat yourself on the head here and call yourself wise for yielding your judgement. Now, if he lies 100 more times, will you say: And what will you do with those 100 instances? My guess is, yield your judgement and pat yourself on the head some more. What about 1000 more times? Will you say: If you don't make a negative judgement onto reality when someone continually lies and deceives and manipulates the truth and spreads falsehood, I have to tell you, you are the biased one. Not a wise one. Case in point, Trumpists. They hear about and see the deception with their own eyes and what do they do with it? "so what... he's still good". BIAS! Like the Trumpists, even if I could get you to admit he's highly deceptive, you would still argue that he has more virtue than vice or that even if he only has 20% virtue, that's enough for you to call it good that his main driver is benevolence and not self-interest. You cannot dismantle what is being said here because that's actually how truth works. I already know every defense you could take and none of them line up with reality. FYI, there's much more evidence beyond an extraordinary record of deception that points to the opposite of benevolence.

I thought it was blatantly obvious as well. But there are quite a few here who disagree. I think it's because they were once Musk fanboys.

Watch the Ted interview aurum shared. Elon says the reason he has so many kids is because he's worried about population collapse and he needs to set an example. He fucks for humanity, not himself. Can't you see guys... he's all-loving. He works 22/7 to prevent catastrophe for humans. @aurum Do you believe he fucks for humanity? Because if you do, well, end of conversation. If you don't, you must not give as much weight to that deception as I do. What I do with it is recognize that if he's that full of shit there, he's highly likely to be full of shit on every other claim of caring about humanity. And since this is just ONE instance of deception or self-deception that exists on top of a mountain of deception, the position that Musk is truly benevolent and not operating from near total self-agenda is absurd. I'm guessing this might be born from once being a Musk fan boy or something. Reflecting back, did you used to admire Elon? If so, that explains it. Your position is one that Fox News, OAN, and Newsmax people believe in, which is: Elon musk = humanitarian genius who has a deep concern for humanity. Whereas the outlets that don't cater to the lowest IQ people on the planet mostly don't have that narrative that you and Fox have. If you want to do spiritual exercises to practice empathy, that's all good. I can empathize with Elon, Trump, or whoever, and see from his worldview and feel for him and train myself to love him if I want to. But this is about epistemology. What is actually true.

This dude said he works to the edge of sanity and it’s all to bring value to humans. He then says even his fucking is philanthropic. He has so many kids because he’s worried about population collapse and he needs to set an example. When Elon gets his dick wet, we’re the real winners.

When I was maybe 5 or 6, I remember contemplating "why can't I remember what it was like before I was born?" I think I even asked a parent this question and they said something like "because you weren't born yet." lol. As a child, it seemed natural that I had always existed. "What was it like before you were born?" An unknowable void. "What is it like when put under anesthesia?" An unknowable void. Given the above, I presume death terminates conscious experience, so death is also the unknowable void. Isn't it odd that on both sides of your conscious experience is the unknowable void? It's like you just magically sprang from nothing. But here's the thing: If conscious experience cannot exist in the void, that means all that can exist is conscious experience. Non-existence cannot be known. The only thing that can ever be known is conscious experience or that which occurs in-between the unknowable voids. The "knower" never ceases to know. I think this is what they mean when they say "you cannot die". The knower will always be conscious of something. And just look for yourself, the only thing YOU have ever known is something outside the voids. Does this make sense? I'm not deep into spiritual study so not sure if this idea or conceptualization has been debunked or found to be flawed but it's the best line of reasoning for the rational mind that I can find that seems to line up with my experience and the highest teachings. Is this flawed?

There was a disagreement on whether Elon is mostly driven by a concern for humanity or a concern for his own selfishness. My argument was, where there is deception on this scale, benevolence is not close by and if it appears to be, it's not genuine. This was oddly, hotly contested.

@bambi My only agenda is to be in alignment with what is true. I just gave you an example of a deception Elon just pulled. What did you do with it? Did you do nothing with it? Did you ignore it? Am I wrong to use this deception to put a mark in the evil column? What should I do with this truth of reality? What is the nature of this particular deception. Where does it likely stem from and why? I'm not afraid to answer these questions. And I have. The questions are rhetorical. No need to respond. Don't want to hijack the thread.

You list his virtues and omit his vices. Why? To get a an accurate sum total, you have to list everything. Add this one thing to your total: Musk claimed his X interview with Trump reached 1 billion views. This is just a single instance of intentional deception that has occured in the past 12 hours. Elon says his interview got 1 billion views. Trump says his rallies get 1 million people, bigger than MLK. This is intentional deception designed to trick unthinking people into thinking they are more popular than they are, for the purposes of serving themselves, not humanity. If you disagree with the above, you disagree with truth. Don't know how else to say it.

Is there a name for this technique or do you have anymore information on it? I recognized the power of this the other day and was trying to figure it out. It's like you have to provide a stepping stone and you can't move forward until you know they are solidly on it. Then, lay out the next one, all the way up until the insight is revealed. I did this with my nephew when showing him how to add 10 to 26 to make 36, without relying on memory. When the insight was revealed to him, he lit up with a smile on his face when he saw that he could KNOW on his own, without relying on memory. All I had to do was know which stepping stones to lay out he engage them. It's interesting that only 20% had a shift. I wonder if the others were not sufficiently engaged? Were they trying in earnest?

Seems only a few people here are dealing in reality. This is a simple matter. One side strongly claims Elon Musk is driven by a deep concern for humanity. The other side strongly claims that is total bullshit and what seems like concern for humanity is just a self-deception he operates on to serve his own self-interest, not humanity. THAT is the argument. One side has read reality wrong. That's all. It can be adjusted if the wrong side wants to let in the truth. Let's not get lost in our egos and attacks.

I'm sorry for being socially inept.

Exactly. This perspective transcends stage green's paradigm lock. To call it stage green doesn't make sense to me, which is why I said, jokingly, funny how stage green can see through stage yellow. It’s probably an easy trap to fall into: if you see many stage green people demonizing Musk, and then you see a stage yellow person doing the same, you might mistakenly label them as green—i.e., blinded by bias. I don't think Leo is any less evolved because he calls Trump a devil. He would say he does so consciously. And I say I am doing the same to Musk. But all of this is irrelevant. It all comes down to reads. Not spiral dynamics. I give people here the benefit of the doubt that they aren't operating on deep bias. We all know where there is deep and common deception, there is deep selfishness and uncommon selflessness. If I can show evidence that suggests off-the-chart levels of deception, this is antagonistic to the perspective that Musk deeply cares about humanity. I have questioned my reads and will look deeper to see if they were skewed. But I wonder if Leo has questioned his. Could he have missed something?

EXACTLY! An intelligent person wouldn't write Musk off as a total bad-actor for one or two deceptions here and there. But they would if the deceptions were common and intentional.

It seems like Leo is saying our assessment of reality regarding Musk is inaccurate and the reason it's inaccurate is our biased worldviews. So the meta issue is we're seeing reality wrong because we've unwittingly made judgements from unconscious bias. This seems incredibly presumptuous. What if I'm just looking at the evidence and then using that evidence to peg Musk at a particular point on the scale of deception/evil? I don't care where he lands on this scale. Pegging him on the scale is the point of disagreement. If you can show why he doesn't deserve a high rank high on my scale, I will gladly move him down. I've yet to watch videos to straighten out my supposed bias, but I will. I've judged Elon as exceptionally deceptive because I think I've objectively observed that and it cannot be negated by any video of him getting emotional. He deceives with intent, not unwittingly, and often. That is my claim, which is supported by ample evidence that I do not think is tainted with bias. We can do loving-kindness meditation all day on Trump and Hitler and Elon. But that doesn't change what the reality is. I just care about what is actually true of reality.

I've noticed this tactic as well. Strange how stage green can see through stage yellow!

@Leo Gura I'll stop commenting. Just point me in the right direction of what I've missed and I'll go look into it.

Question: If for several years there's a significant surge in positive media coverage praising the intelligence and benevolence of the richest man in the world, and if, as a result, millions come to view him as the smartest individual with humanity's best interests at heart, then what are the odds that this man played no role in influencing that media narrative? I mean, whatever happened to occam's razor?

Stories like: "Elon Musk, Modern-Day Einstein..." flooded the media over the past 3 years. Notable influencers have called him the smartest person on the planet. If you talk to any of the millions of people who believe it, they literally think he's a physics genius. Do you think Musk just lucked up or do you think he might have played a role in the very popular narrative he's on the level of Einstein? If that's too speculative for you, you can then listen to him on video act like he is providing the team of rocket scientists valuable insights they couldn't come up with themselves. He walks around and acts like something he's not, ALL THE TIME! My right-wing sister is one of the millions who think he actually is in the lab with the batteries and the rockets. Musk knows a lot people see him this way and I think it's because he played a role in making it so. I suppose he could have gotten lucky and wasn't apart of the 3-year media frenzy that was monumentally beneficial for him, but nonetheless, he cons people to one degree or another. We need a scale of con artistry.

and then intentionally making people think he designed the batteries and the rockets. How is that not a con artist? He's not fleecing people out of money, but he's fleecing something else, and he does it all the time, with intent.

Nice video. That definitely makes sense from an evolutionary perspective.