Mu_

Lol, can't wait for nothing to happen.

I believe Leo commented on this material in a thread in the past and how there are many similarities.

And thats a fine place to be.

Your doing great! Keep with it then. Ya what Nahm said is a eye opener Just a small thing but is it your ego projecting for you? Ya sure its not just another thought form arising and being labeled by You as ego?

Yes! Sometimes the process and attitude of "figuring out" is the same as keeping the belief system alive, like a magnifier glass. To drop the magnifier glass is to drop the belief system happening. Sure some of the familiar thoughts and feelings may come up, but by not figuring them out, giving them additional meaning and story and energy in "the figuring out", the energy becomes less so in experience and there for less concerning and relevant to you. Its "kinda" like this. Next time you feel angry or unpleasant, instantly focus on something pleasant in your experience or think about something that makes you laugh or fill up with warmth and just keep focusing it there. Notice how naturally the anger of unpleasant fades, even if just by a little (this can grow with practice of doing this with uncomfortableness. Also just to note in case your thinking this is avoiding, this is not avoiding the sensation or the discomfort either, its just applying attention elsewhere, to avoid would be to deny it being there or having been there or pushing it away and fighting about it being there.) This can be a radical lesson and can open up a whole new way of being. Now it may be better to practice the above for a while before you get my original paragraph or it may be all you need to give you tools to work through your dilemma. They are almost the same, but a little different, if you understand the nature of putting attention on something or not and how it effects you, then it may become obvious that your attention is on this issue you have in more ways then you realize and "the figuring out" is a form of focusing and keeping something going and that you can drop doing so. But again, this practice of focus changing can be a stepping stone to being able to not needing to figure, feel free to message me in the future when you've practiced the above and want to learn more.

Hmmm. I hear ya and nothing wrong with that. Not sure if this will help you yet, but I’ll put it out there. If no solution has worked for this issue as of yet, perhaps the “solution” isn’t in the realm of figuring it out.

Do you think that by figuring out what is wrong with you it will go away? Like a solution to a puzzle? Most changes in my life never worked this way. What if this wasn't the case, how would you approach your situation then?

This often happens in spiritual teachings. Words don't always mean the same thing when used by each teacher. Being aware of "that" which is aware of experience is the same as directly grasping what something IS.

Why trust and take the "not trusting your experience" route?

I think a big part of growth and waking up is the simple desire to either care and reflect or care and act. Just allowing yourself to pause and listen, question and be open. Tom has become one of my favorite music artists. While I don't agree with all that Tom represents he does a great job of getting you to think about idea's you may have (particularly the age group of this forum). Hes pointing to what I'd call the American collective Ego, and that means you probably listening, challenging industries, race idea's, victim culture, blind following someone or some idea. He often takes both sides of a issue and speaks from their perspective giving their point of view in his lyrics. He's not enlightened but a great deal of valuable lessons don't come from enlightened people either. He's a interesting artist in our times that I think has a important message which if your desire is to self reflect and understand and hear both sides of issues generally only being voiced by people who only believe their side is right, he's worth listening to if you like music and rap, and particularly if your 11-45. Warning, he may offend or bring you judgments and stereotypes to the surface.

I get it, same thing happened to me. But I can tell you that God is not anything different then the middle ground I pointed you to. Perhaps one day you'll laugh and chill out and perhaps not, if you feel more interested in a full one 100% effort to be what you already are, or don't feel like its settled in so to say, then by all means.

It may be, but in scientific terms its still in the air and a lot of research needs to be done, there for pseudoscience for now. All I'm saying is this is a strange forum and pursuit for a person like you, who only wants strict scientific proof before they are open to trying or listening to advice. Perhaps Sam Harris would be someone for you to listen to.

I think your exaggerating and more concerned then you need to be about enlightenment. You can't make it happen, its not something you can imagine, so don't get to insane about it. Do a little of both, even though they really aren't separate. Learn some skills/survival stuff that you atleast enjoy to some degree or believe in and do some yoga, meditation and self inquiry, shadow work or what ever feels useful. Enjoy the outside world sometimes, see a movie or two, watch a show, enjoy some sex, be kind, volunteer here and there, give and advice sharing your own experience when asked. Just relax man, sounds like you got the discipline stuff down, now enjoy yourself and don't make others support you and maybe eventually let go of needing to figure things out and let your natural expression come through.

Just curious, how is chemical-induced mysticism not pseudoscience?

These might be inspirational and within what your looking for. This one is not so much mental illness, although he may have had one due to being raped and beaten as a kid and put in prison falsely for 20 years, hes an incredible inspiration that should put any of your life issue in perspective. If I find more I'll post them. But depression and anxiety disorders run in my family and I definitely have felt this in myself to various and life effecting degree's for years. I've been able to overcome a great degree of this.

Umm, most if not all of the spiritual traditions and practices fall under pseudoscience.

Hi NIghtwise, Just to clarify when you say mental illness do you mean something clinically diagnosed like schizophrenia or bi-polar vs feelings of darkness, mood and emotional swings of various intensities?

lol ok Arnold. But yoga was originally developed to prepare to body and mind for meditation and higher states of consciousness.

I may have experienced something similar to what your going through at one point years ago. It was screwy energetically and when I did a consistent yoga practice to become a yoga teacher, it shifted. Maybe worth a try. Start off gradual and build up to almost daily practice. It may help your body and mind prepare and get use to the shifts happening and that may happen.

If you have serious issues with psychedelics and meditation makes you feel like things are unreal or dreamlike then it may not be great at this time. Its a risk if you want to continue. Deeper metaphysical structures wont feel like anything normal to the mind, unreal and dreamlike may strongly occur along this journey, reality will radically be questioned to such a degree that it may scare the shit out of you. I'm just being real here. If thats something you can understand will happen and if it does as you meditate, contemplate and have you world shift, then do it slowly and see how it goes. But its really important you understand this journey isnt about keeping things "normal" or "real", the Truth can feel like you'v lost your mind at times or for long periods of times. I know what you are, and you do deep deep down, but let me tell ya, if you have a good life, let it be, just enjoy it, not many can do that or have that option right in front of them..

Don't try and detach, because ultimately everything is you, but just recognize boredom or control or wanting to do feelings/thoughts are happening, rather then it consuming you and becoming a more fixed reality. Also everyone you said was illusion and cut off yourself from is you, lol, no need to abandon or try and avoid. I think it would be useful and enjoyable on some level just to start relating in the world in some way. Whats there to be afraid of, its forms of you in different and interesting expressions.

Theres a few things going on here it seems. Judging by the statement above you sound ilke your trying to mentally fit into some idea of what it means to be god or free or spiritual. Like you read somewhere enlightened people dont want or lack, so you've tried to emulate or become that. A good place to start is just admit, your not enlightened and you dont know what it would mean to be, just stop trying to play a game of trying to be enlightened or believing you are, or close. You also seem like you may be in a spiritual transformation phase, I'll explain. You had an experience of waking up to some peace and perhaps some realization of a greater Truth, but there is still old beliefs and energies/emotions that you hold or believe yourself to be. One of these energies is like a person wanting to do something with their discoveries/bored with their discoveries. I'm sure there are moments were this feeling and energy isn't happening, and then out of the blue "it" happens and you feel discontent and want to do something with this peace you see emerging or start thinking what it means or what your supposed to do. This can be a hard place to be in, some traditions call it sitting in the fire of your karma/ego dying. Next time you sit in meditation, just wait at peace, and notice the moment this feeling/belief/energy comes up, notice how it makes experience feel (dont look for it, dont generate it, dont wait for it). Then notice when it passes, even if it doesn't. If it feels like there is a way to drop it, do so, if not, let it be there. Keep repeating this in meditation and in your daily life when you notice this experience arise. You may begin to organically see that this boredom and wanting to control or do something with this peace is just thoughts and emotions arising, that you can get caught in and in so doing you believe yourself to be this and its story.

Well what exactly did you realize? It sounds like in your description that you see some undisturbed peace in your inner experience from a distance, but its not embodied. Like you can point to it and go oh, thats cool and peaceful, but it seems boring and what am I supposed to do with this peaceful object thing over there, and ultimately you feel mostly bored more so then at peace. Does that make sense or feel accurate?

Well meditation will definitely create something other then your use to and I'd imagine it could be felt as dreamlike and unreal. But what do you want Truth for? If lifes good, why look for anything else?

Stop using the word illusion, its to easy to feel and believe its negatively meaningless. Instead appreciate all of what is like a little adventure in Virtual Reality. The void is one of many adventures of Being VR, and one adventure is called childhood, another adulthood, another is sex, vacations, work, relationships, success, failure, confusion, bonding, fear.