bejapuskas

@graji Thanks brother, I am not a med student, but I like understanding things, so I will definitely check that out

@Emerald I see what you are pointing to now... But literally every stage of the tier 1 thinks, that its values are the best, or maybe close to the best. I also dont understand, why it can be, that if a blue person goes into orange, he doesnt become orange. (if he does value it of course, friends might just make him do it...) From what Leo is saying, I imagine green as someone, who is disgusted by grafitti, sex, drugs, alcohol... People who do these things are usually orange or red in my point of view, I have never seen it as you are seeing it. Do you think, that if a girl is really emotional, volunteers in a hospital, is very caring, has many friends around her... that it can actually be blue? Its not like a dogma, it really appears to me as green, how is it not green? The same with orange, I have a friend, who is probably still a bit blue, but he is so obsessed with science, he could gradute from high school in the age of 15 and he criticizes even people like Wim Hof, he would think they are literally cheating or using some technological device in their lungs... I just feel that these things that you named can appear in any stage in tier 1, its not just a matter of blue.

@graji Is it safe to follow his regimen without his control though? I think its very risky, but I really want to try it!

@Emerald I dont understand, what do you mean by blue/orange... Can you describe it more accurately please? It just feels that there is no way, that most of my classmates are blue. I am probably very green, some orange, some yellow, but... my classmates are green or orange, maybe some are red and blue, but its definitely not the majority

@Emerald What country do you live in?

Hey guys, I think that my relationship with my mum and dad could be a lot better, I am making it grow by helping my parents cook, vacuuming and stuff like that, but when I am running around, only helping my parents, I cannot really grow that much, if you add school and other necessities to the equation. The problem is, even if I do help them, they still say that I dont know what life is about (they are both quite neurotic people) and that I should stop watching that weird bald man and the weird bearded man and rather focus on having fun. But they dont see inside me, they think that meditation and contemplation is meaningless, they dont see my inner growth and they are so brainwashed and close-minded, but I have to have a good relationship with them, because I live with them and will live with them for a long time from now. I have been doing self-development for like half a year now and it has really made a difference inside me. But my parents only see me watching my hand and saying mantras, as I am practising Kriya yoga. They dont respect Leo, because they think he is just another faculty of Arts students without any deeper knowledge. How do I balance that? I dont want to accept their blue values, it would slow down my growth and I wouldnt feel like I am living to my fullest...

@7thLetter You might be partially right, but I live with them, they can see me watching Leo and doing all these spiritual practises. In my opinion, its better to tell them that I am gonna do Wim Hof method, than if they thought I am fapping or something... I live in different conditions. But generally, I agree that its not a good idea to tell others about it, if you dont actually know that it might help them. About your job... I think that you should keep this private and focus all your brain power to your actions and improvement. Actions speak louder than words, when it comes to business and making money in my opinion.

@brugluiz Congratulations man, how are you feeling?

@Elisabeth Thanks Elisabeth, itsd great that we are finally starting to agree on this, sometimes, I have these kinds of explosions of immatureness, which cause me to think that everyone else is deluded, I have to work on transcending the lower stages in order to move deeper into tier 2. If I would actually find a way to make money, oh man, that would be huge in my age. I dont mean that kind of selling ice-cream thing, even though I might want to start with that, just to see what its like. I meant that some people who graduate from college and work, even like 40, 50 year olds (my parents' friends) sometimes seem so stubborn and selfish to me, its incredible. I understand its more complex than just that, but when I am starting to see all these opportunities, like finding a life purpose, meditating every day... Life seems so full.

@Elisabeth I see, its better if I enjoy cooking the lunch with my mum, rather than just cooking it for the rational benefit... The thing is, I want to experiment with my diet, hobbies and other stuff, but I don't make money to do that, they are my source of income, I am 15. I am thinking about how to go around that every single day, but if I started making money the way I want, my growth will then stagnate and my work won't be of the best quality... My dad is kind of addicted to smoking and alcohol and he sees my gettig rid of addictions as something negative, he thinks that I am not enjoying my life. If I just accept that, it might cost him his life quite soon actually... I want to be assertive and push them, so that they can live to their fullest, I just need to find the right way. Probably, I should just live as an example and maybe they will join me on my journey...

@7thLetter I use the word you, because you were relating to yourself, I am not trying to lecture you or anything, but it just seems like you are having a big aha moment, as well as me... Me and my friends who are into self-actualizing have a similar problem, they have a great relationship with their parents, but their parents disrespect Leo and other teachers and they actually think that they know everything about life. I mean, that they have lived their whole life in one direction, never really tried a different life-style and they are acting like they know, what is good for me and others... I understand why this is happening, but then it really makes it hard to balance our relationship. They wanted me to quit video games and anime, so I quit that and I am very happy, but they now want me to quit reading and meditation lol

@7thLetter I am not assuming anything about her, but it might be useful to at least give it a try You never know... I will probably try pick-up... Thanks man!

@7thLetter You can also take it as that you cannot do the Work very effectively, when you cannot even handle 2 people inside your house @Sahil Pandit @okulele Of course, we do love each other, thats obvious, but... yeh, I am probably not doing the best job in balancing our relationship. Taking 100% responsibility is much easier than whining...

@7thLetter I see... I am already doing most of these things, maybe I could try learning more about pick-up. I dont see a girlfriend as some kind of colourful trophy lol. I know a lot of girls, but I am not really attracted to any of them. Its not because they arent yellow, but its just some aspect of their personality, that doesnt attract me. I used to fall in love very often, when I was depressed, but now, when I cured my negative feelings, I no longer feel the urge to fill in the gaps with someone else, that could be a problem, if I try to do pick-up. I hate to lie and manipulate, as I used to do it and it only made my life worse in general. Do you think a school psychologist could help me to deepen my understanding of the lower stages? I mean, her services are free and she could make my contemplation and thinking process more effective, thus helping me evolve from tier 1 fully.

This is my reaction to your edit. I basically became so fed up with my need for approval that I became green and was trying to help other people, but that became very limiting soon. I also tried veganism for moral reasons and I was basically a weakling because of that. I havent really transcended these stages the best way I could, so I am on my way to revisit all the stages including beige. I would also like to describe what I mean, but that would only prolong our conversation. I think its just my disability to express myself precisely. Anyway, back to the topic. Can you please give me any advice about the thing I mentioned above? I am still very interested. I havent said that I NEED a relationship, I just said that I have never had a healthy one and that closes me off from some growth that I could collect. I hope you understand my situation better now, so we can actually get back to the theme.

@Hellspeed What do you mean? It seems that my parents want me to help them do the housework, but that does not solve their problems and they are often stressed out and I want them to see that, as it could deepen our relationship even further. It otherwise seems just like a repetetive series of mechanical help and I do not have time to learn new things because of that...

@okulele I am actually reading Katie's book right now, I really like it. I understand that I have to nurture them, I probably know what you mean by that, but it's kinda hard, when it's clear that both of my parents are very close minded and helping them externally won't solve their inner problems, that they have, I am kind of worried about them sometimes, but they see it as arogance. I actually recommended them to read the book too, but they are not open to this kind of literature. What do you think I can do about that?

@7thLetter You are still misunderstanding a lot of things. You have actually made many assumptions about me, just re-read what you said. You are actually making assumptions about everyone here. You are even making assumption about the „typical“ yellow/green/orange/blue individual. About Leo, he is not all that good or bad. Some people might get him correctly and develop themselves, but there are people, who are terribly depressed, because they have entered the beta stage of Spiral dynamics because of what they heard in his videos. (= stage, where you just cannot understand, what the hell is happening with you, you cannot really transition further, it can even end in a suicide) I even have a person on facebook who told me that he is suicidal and things that Leo is a freak. It really is a matter of attitude, perspective and approach. Orange has 2 ends of the spectrum. It can either be lazy and cocky or driven by negative motivations, most of the time. I was really into video games, orange self-development, I even bought some courses from people like Tai Lopez... I also wanted to impress people by learning difficult languages like Japanese and Chinese, I think this counts as orange as well. I didnt do badly, but it didnt bring me any happiness at all, I was heavily dependent on people flattering my achievements. Yellow person can still make tons of relationships, if he is good at finding people who understand him and support his ideas and work, why would he ever reject these people? Its about finding them, if you havent created a network of people like this before, it probably is hard to find them, but that doesnt apply to me, because with my knowledge of languages, I can immmidiately attract speakers of these languages and people who are also learning and people, who are learning languages like Japanese for some more meaningful purposes (not like mine, when I was learning), they tend to be very intelligent and disciplined people, who are worth talking to, at least from my experience. Dont take this as some sort of hateful debate, I admit that I have a lot of things that I have to work on, but I am definitely not mostly blue/orange. The reason why I started to tell you this was because some people here were giving me advice that didnt really give me almost anything, as I am beyond that. I am also not craving for a relatioship, as some people here are probably thinking. Its just that people have created so many assumptions about me, so I dont want this thread to go to waste completely.

Hey guys, I think that this forum is a great opportunity to share your ideas and help each other, but it also has a dark side of things. If you arent interested, you can just skip my story, but it can probably still help you to write better quality answers. I started watching Leo when I was 13 and I was very neurotic and ready to do orange self-development. I was obviously very impatient, so I couldnt watch any of his videos all the way to the end. I didnt get anything out of them. About a year later, as my depression and anxiety was getting worse and my friends were pointing it out, I realized, I need to do action and grow out of this. I decided to watch all of Leo's videos and learn something. As I was watching the first, oldest videos, I realized, that most of them are probably outdated and I went to watch the „Start here“ section. Video after video, I was making notes, rereading them, making action in my life, did everything Leo adviced me to do and my life transformed. I am no longer depressed, I actually feel so passionate about my life and I love to learn, so I also quit video games and PMO cycles. I started meditation and contemplation, started meeting more advanced people around my place and I am so happy that I am finally out, yet I still enjoy the vast not knowing. After I achieved this kind of state, I decided that I could probably join this forum, as it would not offend anyone probably. I started to ask about diet, spirituality etc... Later I realized, that I can find almost all the answers to my questions inside and that made me rebuild everything I knew. I still ask some questions, but not as often as I used to. SKIP TO HERE: The thing is, that many people here are very legit advice givers. These people are probably watching Leo for a long time and doing what he advices them to do. But some people just feel like they have watched around 3 videos in their life, without clearing their brain of false assumptions and addictions, they go here on this forum and start assuming that they ate all the wisdom. By this, I dont mean that I ate all the wisdom, I actually learn and collect information everyday and still make 180 degrees turn arounds often. Please, people, stop assuming that, it would make this forum so much better. Some of the threads we create are full of shit, talking about them externally is just bringing more trash. Do some action in your life, this will make the difference, stop addictions, stop false assumptions, learn everyday...

What do you mean? Thanks, I still have to cut out some sublte addictions, but I have already got rid of the biggest problems, like Netflix for example I try to write my best on this forum, as it may change many peoples lives severely, if I dont do so.

@7thLetter As far as I remember, I havent said that I am the same level of yellow as Abraham Maslow or the authors of Spiral dynamics are. I just said, that I entered it, I am starting to see the world through these eyes. If I did make this model seem simple, it was caused by that I dont want to write my whole life story here, it doesnt even make sense. You know absolutely nothing about me, but I agree on that I have very little experiences, but you dont know that I am working on becoming an adult now, it just takes time, I just entered this stage, I am still very green, but I get that I am unpractical as hell. By the way, many people who are adults arent by any means lazy or undisciplined - they cannot be the other way, because the orange system manipulates them into thinking, that thats the way they have to live! I actually dont speak to most of my friends, but I cannot stop doing it completely, as I go to school with them and it happens very consciously. Do you think that every yellow person has to lack social skills? Why? If you at have least some compassion, you would at least try to not make the other peoples lives miserable, just by interacting with them and ignoring them as you are doing it. Its just that I much rather read a book, but they come to me and want to gossip, which I dont like to initiate into. Most of my friends are at least 10 years older than me, I have deep bonds with them, we share books, talk about interesting topics - learning doesnt only mean sitting at home, reading or watching Leo, but we also have a little bit of fun sometimes, why not. Even an enlightened master can laugh at peoples jokes, going tier 2 doesnt make a total geek from you. Our meetings look more like sophisticated and objective discussions without any resentful arguments about politics, rather than meaningless drinking and smoking electronic cigarettes, as most of the people in my age do. Even people above my age do that, including my family. The thing is, that the evolution is going further, generation after generation, most elders are blue because of that in contrast to my generation, where most people are either blue, orange or green. (or even a mixture of these 3, as you are saying) Please, dont think that I am aggressive, its very hard to communicate without body language and facial expression, especially when discussing a topic like this. I am actually open to any advices, if I wasnt, I wouldnt ask you guys questions. Its just hard to accept these advices, when most of them are already irrelevant for me. @Emerald What do you mean by the need for Blue development in my age? You can develop some great habits and values through Blue thinking, but its very biased otherwise, blue people are those who are bullied and have no friends nowadays. They either get depressed and change schools, without evolving, or they are just forced to go further. I am not saying that I or you are ignoring this stage, its very important to see the strengths and weaknesses of it, but its very easy to enter orange, when most people are surrounded by the internet. I dont know how old are you Emerald, but teenagers arent blue nowadays, boys are mostly orange/blue and girls are green/orange/blue, but its easy to get fed up with these colours, if you take self-development seriously and do the actual work, listening to what Leo is saying carefully and doing action. Maybe we all take the Spiral dynamics model a bit differently, I am still mostly Green, but I dont think I have that much Blue, probably have some Orange, but definitely not Blue. I realized the need for adult development without you pointing it out to me. It just takes time, I am not the same league as Nietzsche or Elon Musk by any means, Yellow has many shades and tones, just as every other colour does. I hope you understand my situation better now. Growing through pain makes miracles happen, I know what it means to be stuck at Blue, it sucks, its painful. I am probably a bit Orange, but I notice, that my level of compassion and empathy is skyrocketing nowadays, so I think that I am going into Green more. I definitely have a glimpse of Yellow, but its enough to understand many systems around me. It also seems that I balanced my personality way better than it used to be balanced. Thats very hard for tier 1 person to do. As Leo said, if you trust Spiral dynamics and dont lie to yourself, yoour growth can be multiplied by 10 easily.

@Shin Great, I am doing that everyday... It probaby cant be helped otherwise, was just curious...

Dont you guys think, that you could grow yourself more or do something, that could inspire way more people, than just being on this forum? To me, it is no longer a win-win-win situation, I dont know if I am the only one thinking like this... Is there a solution to that?

@Arthur I agree on this with you, the things is, noone knows me here, noone here has a direct experience of my life on this forum. People have difficulties trusting me with this particular thing, thus making it impossible for me to talk with them meaningfully. I also want to do progress and take something from others, but its very hard, when people give me advice as if I was blue or orange.

@Lorcan Thanks Lorcan! It probably is a trap to assume that, but it seems like I have already went beyond that point where it is just an assumption, way too many things have changed and I actually feel the things Leo is saying in his video, I dont really have to go deep inside - that doesnt mean that I or you should stop growing by any means, there are many shades of yellow, just as any other colour. I am now re-visiting all the stages again, TJ gave me a good push in that direction, even though I dont agree on absolutely everything he is saying, but it could just be that I I dont get him. It seems like he is creating his own model, which is working quite well, if you understand it.