Identity

After watching most of the video on the forum and reading Leo’s comments, I would like to open a conversation on the topic of new age. It seems that my ‘form’ is to a large extend that of a new-ager. Most of the characteristics mentioned in the video are boxes I check: - Beliefs, attitudes, clothes (to some extend), relationships, interests, practices. A telling sign; one of the people at the tantra centre where my girlfriend and I are doing a series of seven retreats said: ”I assume that you’re one of those ‘man circle’ guys, that lack any spiritual depth.” Aaand, my reply was; ‘I kind of do, huh? Looking at my feminine loose patterned pants.’ Aaand, at the same time, I truly feel that I have directly grasped, experienced and am embodying many of the truths and principles that we pursue in this work. Interestingly enough, from a young age, it had been challenging for me to find my place. To ‘create myself’. To take a particular form in the collective world. In the end… some form needs to be taken right? You’re either wearing feminine loose patterned pants, or you’re wearing stiff jeans in which it’s impossible to move. I’ll take the first any day of the week. Anyhow, I’m opening the floor here; Are any of you taking this form as a ‘new ager’? or have you found other ways of finding your place in this collective world?

@integral Haha, daym, looks like you’re crossing boundaries I aint ready for yet. Agreed though; underwear? Silly restraining invention 😝

@Moutushi hahaha, that sounds like a fantastic time 🕺🏻

Haha this discussion puts a smile on my face. Love you guys ❤️✌🏼

Right, if I understand you correctly, this perspective is similar to the point I’m trying to make. Just like @Leo Gura says ‘no legs, no pants, no problem’. Yet, if I see the ‘form’ Leo walking around. There will be legs, and most likely, there will be pants. Right? Unless you’re THAT wild. @UnbornTao and yes, the possibility to eliminate beliefs sounds great. Yet, when you’re in a conversation with someone, words are still being said, right? However awake, detached, loose, the ideas are held, surely there is still some general philosophy that acts as your operating system? These examples are symptoms of the underlying idea; No matter how deeply one gets grounded into nothingness, there will still be some form that appears, right? That’s actually what I’ve been really enjoying about the tantric perspective. Yes, be deeply rooted in the formless. But don’t reject the form, fully infuse your consciousness into that form. Feel it. Live it. Live the human experience.

@Lila9 Yup, definitely agree that there is a lot of stage greeny shallowness going around in most new age places. And then again, it also varies a lot depending on the community and the individuals. It comes back for me to this challenge; there is some form that needs to be taken. Some way to show up, behave, interact, live. Say you want to dance, waaay rather go to a hippy-filled Ecstatic Dance then to go to a macho orange club. I guess the point I’m making; if behind the new age externals, there is actually the seriousness, the depth, the direct experience. Don’t see the problem.

@Leo Gura Surely you own a pair of those loose patterned pants yourself 😉

Happy to see you doing well Leo ✌🏼 if this wasn’t a tragic death of a young girl, I’d propose it to be a meme. Perhaps a mouse trap is a better fit 😂😅 oke, the croc is definitely better. subtitles: “Are you sure?”

After a phase with the theme ‘Resting in Being’ I sense a renewed desire in me to grow into a new way of being. What I am contemplating, is the ‘bridge’ of getting from my current way of being to the vision I have. Let me explain. When I got into the world of personal development and spirituality I had to climb out of quite a deep hole. My reality then was; - I had very little discipline - There were many habits and addictions that were dragging me down; smoking weed, gaming, porn, unhealthy eating, the usual suspects - I had no idea who I was and what kind of life purpose to pursue - Very little experience with dating It’s a bit of a simple way of explaining a more nuanced situation, but in many ways I was a lost student. Over the last 6-7 years my life has improved radically. The list above can basically be flipped around. I am excelling at all of these domains for the most part. From dating, to business, to lifestyle, as well as many spiritual layers have opened up. With that period of change being quite exhausting on many layers, the past 6 months or so have been on the theme ‘Resting in Being’. Ending that chapter with a month of holiday, I feel recharged and want to take myself and my life to the next level. The vision for it I can see quite clearly. What is unclear to me, is the ‘bridge’, the ‘how’. With how I don’t mean the practices or practical steps, that is clear to me as well. It’s more about the way I want to pursue this change. See, the ‘bridge’ that was very effective to get to where I got consisted of: - huge vision board - Many goals and habits - (Neurotically) tracking - Setting commitments - Consuming a lot of content It was the structure and discipline I needed to pull myself out of this whole. But it also came with a tightness, guilting myself, whipping myself. This whole system had melted away for the most part and I have learned that I can trust myself to function also without it. So the question is, what new ‘bridge’ do I want to build? I know it will be lighter, less structured, less mental, more intuitive… yet, it won’t be nothing either… ‘Conscious Discipline’ is a term that comes up, but what that will entail is yet to be shaped. Would love to hear your inputs and happy to answer questions ✌?

Was just rewatching the episode on Authority. Am now 40 minutes in. There are some confusions and nuances I want to lay out here. On the absolute domain, I’m on board. God is the true identity. Looking for any form to validate absolute truth is silly, since it is a partial element of God. In the end, I am God and that is all there is. (That’s to say, I’m on board theoretically. I’ve had various experiences of becoming conscious of it, but at this moment there is little direct experience of this.) Now, where things get murky for me is in the relative domain. It seems to me that there is more going on than saying it’s simply a matter of projecting out authority and in the end I get to decide what’s true. Oke, now that I’m writing this out, it becomes clear to me that as long as there is the belief that I’m an individual ego, it’s a very tricky game…. What would happen if I were really fully conscious as myself as God…. I guess that would give me full authority, even in the relative domain, since I’m the one creating the whole thing…?! Nevertheless, let’s lay out the line of reasoning that came up before. So, in the relative domain, let’s say I do identify as this body-mind being. From that perspective it does make sense to have a sense of authority, right? For example, I need to get my bike fixed because I have a flat tire. It would make sense to give the mechanic who has fixed 1000’s of tires more authority than the kid who has never done it before, right? And let’s say, I would have never fixed a tire before and have no clue how to do it, then it would make sense to listen to someone ‘outside myself’ to gain information on the topic, right? This comes back to the whole discussion on ‘what is understanding’. Yes, ultimately all language, beliefs and images are a mere subset of absolute truth and will always be partial. But in the relative domain, there are ways of building up a mental construction that has resemblance of an object or process. And in this survival game of relative mental constructions, it can make sense to give authority to ‘others’ who have created a more effective, more truthful mental construction. To make this topic a bit more personal, the reason it’s so interesting to me, is because my profession is to be a trainer/growth facilitator. So I give trainings on topics such as leadership, softskills and personal development. The game of authority is very prevelant here, not something I particularly like, but it’s a necessary game to play in order to survive in the business. There are many authority claims I refer to, from my education, to experience, to sources, to results, to even the way I dress and talk. I guess I am finding my way in navigating this in a balanced and relatively authentic way. Those are enough thoughts for now, would love to hear some reactions ✌?

8 years ago being courageous was not a trade associated with me. When I asked people around me what my top 5 strengths are last year, courage was part of everyone’s list. Reflecting on my growth process, I would say it was a rather gradual one. As Nathaniel Daniel describes, self-esteem is a reciprocal trade. When we have more self-esteem, we act like it. When we act like it, we grow in self-esteem. my advice would be to deliberately start taking small courageous steps outside of your comfort zone. Pick-up can be great for this. I did door-to-door sales which helped. Starting your own business. Talking to strangers. Posting something online. Expressing your boundaries. The list is endless. Brain Begin from Fearless has this technique called smth like the ‘tension journal’. Where he would note down throughout the day which actions he could take and which degree of tension they would be. 1 being completely comfort zone. 10 being completely out. Then he would challenge himself to do actions in the 4-7 range to train his courage. In the end, what I’m saying is that courage, bravery and decisiveness can be seen as a skill. Train it deliberately and you will grow.

One thing I see myself and a lot of people around me struggle with, is creating conscious discipline. To use Spiral Dynamics, what I see is a lot of people of my generation in the wealthy west are at this orange/green border. However, they lack a solid blue foundation. Beyond lacking it, there is actually resistance to it. And for good reason. A stage green person who is working on self-acceptance does not want to go back to create discipline through self-judgement. That is a lot of self-help around the topic of discipline; a super-ego being hard on itself. Conquering your inner bitch. Guilting oneself. Pushing away emotions. my question; how can one go about creating conscious discipline? I intuit that there must be a more conscious way of building discipline, perseverance and structure than described above. However, I can’t quite get a grasp on what that looks like. Any ideas?

@LastThursday Thank you for sharing. Yes, I agree that having a clear payoff is crucial in order to sustain the discipline over a long time. I think the crux in discipline is that it is the ability to do something, even when resistance shows up in the form of emotions/thoughts. on insight that comes to me whilst typing this, is that conscious discipline would be the ability to still fully feel, embrace, accept whatever is going on inside, and then choosing to act. Which is the opposite of hoe discipline is often thought of; pushing away, denying, rejecting, belittling the resistance. You mention the phrase ‘conscious disciple ins being aware of the process of being disciplined’. I don’t fully get what you are pointing to with this, could you elaborate?

Why not go for the mother? Oke, all jokes aside, I agree, mostly who you are being and who she is being will be the most important. There is no quick fix to create a conscious relationship, the individual inner work will have to be done first. It sounds like the basis is right, both on a similar path of growth with aligned values. That being said, creating a conscious relationship could also be seen as a separate skill. What has really benefited my relationship is a tantric approach where both people are allowed to be where they are at, feel what they feel, without that being judged or needing to change.

Am on a tantra retreat. This van is of one of the participants. Couldn’t imagine a better example of stage green ?

Thanks for the tips. More plants, yes. Air purifyers, perhaps, I’ll keep that in mind. Cat and aquarium, no thanks ?

I will give a bit of context here. However, if you would like further information, feel free to ask and I will provide it. So, around three years ago I started my business called Realize. The mission is to support the next generation to create their reality through workshops coaching and events. Yes, Leo's work and Actualized have inspired it greatly. In the previous 'chapter' of the business, I had to model to collaborate with educational institutions. I came to the point of having a network of 20 institutions that would book me for workshops, as well as do some one-on-one coaching on the side. It was going... but to be honest, it was still a struggle to really create a consistent outcome of it. Nonetheless, I had helped 1000+ people in this way. I felt like continuing this path would lead to success down the line. In September I kind of doubled down on the business. See, it was not, and is not, the only thing I do career-wise. But I made new commitments about time investments and also had four interns joining me to help grow the business. I was definitely on fire. However, it felt like the educational institution side was showing some resistance. Booking a workshop for a couple of hundred euro's for a young entrepreneur was fun and cute, paying a couple thousand for a series of workshops did not catch on quite as well. With my inner momentum building a new opportunity presented itself out of nowhere. My own location! Without really having this in mind, I got offered a location in the centre of Maastricht, The Netherlands where I live. It's a beautiful space at a great location and at an even greater price. The one caveat.. I rent it anti-squatting, which means that there is no certainty for how long I can stay. Basically, at any moment I could get a letter that says I have one month to pack my stuff. That is not ideal... but still. It really felt like a present from the universe. On the same day I went to view it, I got the keys. Out of nowhere, I had my own location! Great, right? Well, it turned out not to be as easy as expected. The investments in terms of finances, time and energy were larger than I had predicted. For the past three years I had worked hard to find a balanced flow in my work, and the location basically threw that whole flow off. The past two months have been quite a lot. Paddling on all sides to make things work. Especially on the financial side, I wanted to 'carry this burdon' myself, and declined help from parents and friends. It's a theme for me that I want my own flow to make sense, be independent. So I was working double on both sides; setting up the location which COSTS money and doing extra freelance work to support it. It felt important to my own journey that I carried the outcomes of the decision I made. Now, it has been two months since I first got the key. The place is fully furnished. Internet is (finally) installed. There is a group chat of 60 people interested in personal growth that I set up. I've talked to around 10 facilitators who also want to use the space to host personal growth events. My financial situation still is not great... but I feel like I've gotten past the peak of the challenge. So here I am. The vision is to make this a centre of personal growth filled with love and wisdom. I see a community of hundreds of people who regularly come for all types of events; meditation, journaling, morning routines, conscious movement, mindfulness, sharing circles, coaching and more. Basically, I want this to be the place where personal growth HAPPENS. From where I stand now to where the vision is, there are quite a few things already in place. Myself and others around me are basically ready to start hosting sessions. The main challenge... regular paying clients. I know this is the crux of most businesses... yet in a way, I feel like things could go pretty quickly. However, my approach so far has not worked too well. See, I've already hosted 5-10 events here. But so far, it has all been pretty last-minute thrown together. 'Hee, on Sunday we are doing this' 'Two days from now we do this'. That has not worked very well. There have only been a couple of people showing up to those events so far. So, my question is, how do I build momentum in a WISE way? My intuition so far is to host regular recurring events. And to start with just a few. For example a weekly recurring guided meditation. Kind of like building a fire. The spark is there. Now to bring that spark into the place. Gently blow on it. Gently start adding some paper and twigs. And only add bigger logs once there is enough momentum. So, that is my brain dump. There is a lot more that could be shared, but this covers the essence. Would love some wisdom on how this momentum could be built. Preferably by people who have done something like this before. Thank you in advance.

Definitely wise to go inside, feel, contemplate, compare. on thing that might help is to put each option on a piece of paper and write about that option. Put the pieces of paper in different parts in the room and walk around. Whilst standing on each paper imagine what your future would look like if you made that choice. Also consider that there might not be a ‘right choice’. Rather different choices that lead to different futures.

My ex girlfriend was a 25 year old hot girl. my current lover is a wise 34 year old tantric goddess. Wisdom over appearance any day of the week. The sex is better by a mile too ?

Perhaps this actually fits better in the life purpose section. Could someone move it please?

Let me rephrase the situation. Let's look at three situations; A: starting position, B: current reality and C: desired future. As well as what strategies that were used to get from A to B (which we will call strategy 1) and what strategy will need to be deployed to get from B to C. A: Starting position Imagine being a personal growth facilitator who has developed and given dozens of workshops, has a coaching certification, has a somewhat established brand (logo, style, etc.). Out of nowhere, you get a beautiful location in the centre of a small student city (with 25kish students). No time to have prepared for it in terms of strategy, or anything like that. With a caveat; it's unclear how long you can stay. The landlord can send a letter and you'll have to pack your stuff within 30 days. Here is a video from when I first got the place: 1. Strategy from starting position to current reality After getting the place 2,5 months ago, I started employing the following strategies. Keep in mind that this all happened part-time next to other freelance work and having had still quite a few workshops and coaching scheduled from my previous business model: - Furnishing the place. With a low budget the place now is fully furnished into an office, coaching room and workshop space: - Connected with other facilitators. I pretty quickly realized (no pun intended) that I was not the only one who was going to be facilitating coaching and workshops here. Therefore I started connecting with a bunch of other personal growth facilitators, inviting them over to the space and talking about collaborating. With a few actually already collaborated. Also renting out the space a couple of times for other facilitators. - Hosting events. I pretty quickly started hosting some of my own events as well as with some other facilitators. They have been mixed in results. Overall, getting people to show up has been quite challenging since my network was basically non-existent. There were some flyers distributed as well, but quite last-minute for the event which did not really end up helping. - Creating a Whatsapp community. Creating and sharing a Whatsapp community. With people I know, in sharing it in some other groups and through word of mouth. In general, these past 2,5 months definitely have not been wasted. At the same time, it did not get me to the place I was hoping to get to either. One lesson I'm taking away; Do things strategically, consistently and well. Don't do a lot of scattered stuff at the same time last-minute. B: Current reality Let's look objectively at some facts about where this place stands now: - It is fully furnished. - There is a network of 10ish facilitators interested in hosting events here. - There is a Whatsapp community of 65 people. - There is an Instagram following of 300 people. - There are around to 3-5 recurring events from various facilitators (since this week). - Some sessions people show up for, for others not. - The location has not yet generated more than a couple hundred euro's in total. C: Desired future Looking at where I would like this place to be, I would like for it to become a lively place where a people come on a regular basis for their personal growth. A place filled with love and wisdom. Very active with all kinds of expanding sessions. My own workshops, meditations, coaching sessions. Other facilitators come in doing yoga, breath work, conscious movement, you name it. There is a community of around 500 people who regularly visit this place. Some maybe more than others, but definitely that it is very popular. To the point that I just have to announce an event and there are people jumping on it. It's a known name here. There are people coming in and out of here. The place is alive. With that, it also generates solid revenue. To the point that I'm earning a couple thousand out of running the place myself, and other facilitators that host here are also satisfied. The flow makes sense for all involved. That's about it. This is an established growth centre that everyone benefits from being a part of. 2. Strategy current reality to desired future The big question: How to move from the current reality to the desired future? Obviously, I have some ideas and strategies in place and in mind, which I can share. First, I'd love to hear some of your thoughts!

Was just skimming through the forum and saw the thread about Nahm no longer being part of the forum. A lot of the messages surprised me. I haven’t been on the forum a lot lately, but Nahm has made a very positive impression on me. This is an unfiltered story about an experience with him from my perspective. It is a bit out there, do with it what you will. Somehow I feel called to share it. Here it goes. So, after some positive interaction on the forum with Nahm and one free call when he started hosting 1-on-1 sessions, I booked a session with him when he started charging 150 dollars for them. I was actually hesitant for a bit, mostly the price was holding me back. It was the same ‘service’ I had for free months earlier after all. This came at a point where I was feeling quite low in my journey and felt like this could be a positive step forwards. I ended up booking the spot on a Tuesday for the Friday that same week. In the night of that same Tuesday I had wild and healing dreams. One of the challenges I was coping with was backpain. After seeing around a dozen of physical therapists, chiropractors, docters, doing MRI scans, the whole chabang, I was not any closer to a solution. There was this one alternative lady who told me I had been killed with a spear in that spot in a past life… but I was sceptical to the point of not really taking it too seriously. However, in the dreams on that Tuesday, I actually relived the experience of being stabbed in the back. Not only that, I experienced powerful healing on the wounds. Some guy, who in the dream appeared as Arnold Swarzenegger (lol), came and healed me on multiple layers. There were also some further dreams which revealed interesting insights. The morning afterwards I woke up feeling better than I had felt in years. Completely rejuvenated. Although I still experience some degree of back pain in that spot to this day, it was a major turning point in the severity of that pain. Again, do with that story what you will. Just felled like I wanted to share that.

Hmm oke, from what I read here there were actually some odd things going on. Thank you for filling me in. I was not/barely around the last months and missed all of this.

Would be interesting to analyse your following as a whole. Who are the people that follow you and could they be divided into different segments? Just from my intuition, I would guess that there is actually a core audience who are loyal followers. The people that have watched most of your videos. The people who have been around for the past 3-5+ years. The people who you hooked from the beginning and took on this journey. Myself included. That segment probably has different needs from other segments. For example, I could also imagine there being segments of 'noobies' just discovering your work, perhaps also your older videos. Or people who have been in the personal growth/spiritual field for a longer time.

@roopepa Nope, but the same night this story happened. @Leo Gura Oke, thank you for putting the situation into context. Still, interesting to see how one of the most beloved members of the community who has helped many people on this forum has now been completely recontextualized. Wonder whether that says more about Nahm, or about the collective of this forum.