Jack River

Haha

It takes as long as we make it take. ?

I edited it to perhaps bring light to what I mean

??? = Subject/object (background) ?=? = Awareness (Foreground) Not ? = Awareness (Background) ??? = Subject/object (foreground)

?

What @Leo Gurahas posted is actually pretty obvious. It’s only confusing when it is taken out of context. We will build our understanding on a foundation of presumptions. This tends to lead to confusion when we try to understand it according to the contents of our already existing knowledge & experience as consciousness being limited to the body/mind and the world being independent of that body mind. We don’t see it is all I, and implies that aloneness. Many also associate this aloneness with isolation as well, but that is not the case. Aloneness has a sense of intimacy, and greater sense of harmony/communion. But really it is all right in plain site. Direct perception or direct experience reveals it as rather obvious indeed.

Exactly, you don’t see the image. Fosho. But if i am trying to explain how I see being and choicless observation the same I need to use thought to relay that to you or another. Using thought, not letting it use us?

Indeed. That again is what I mean by choicelessly observing that movement night man?

By the way, I got a new hammock to hang. going to install it now. Appreciate your posts dude?

I understand. It’s difficult to find a balance in communication indeed.

Gotta remember it all comes off as philosophy, concepts when communicating with words. It’s up to us to see the difference and understand what’s being pointed at. The description is not the described right. Its one thing to communicate a particular branch of knowledge/thought, and another when simply trying to communicate the actuality of something being limited to concepts and such. I mean for the most part all writing on here can be interpreted as philosophical, conceptualization, etc.

@Joseph Maynor what you are referring to is the same thing that I was speaking of. Your term being is the equivalent of my term choiceless observation/watching.

Fosho. I agree That is also implied in choiceless observation.

@Joseph Maynor its not about ideas, philosophy, concepts or anything of that nature. It’s purly about self observation/direct perception not tainted by subject/object phenomenon..When we speak here on the forum it will manifest as such. But what I am referring to does not have it’s essence in that of thought.

Fosho. I feel ya dude.. Choiceless observation/watching too doesn’t modify any further concept. Both are of and as unpremeditated awareness. Pure Consciousness. Yet the arising and falling manifestations too have there root in THE NOW. Again one totality.

If one used watching as a concesssion to achieve or move to “higher stage” that premeditated action(doing) had its root in subject/object activity, therefore is a watching distorted by control/effort. That is a different type of watching.

There can be no watching without the freedom of being. As THE NOW/BEING there is watching/choicless observation of arising and falling subject/object activity. Watching is without premeditation, complete awareness of the present without preference, effort, or compulsion, control(a doing). Awareness/Being rests as itself and watches Subject/Object movement arise and fall, until total silence/no-thing-ness...But watching depends on being and being depends on watching. But doing is of subject/object activity. THE NOW/BEING-AWARENESS and what is watched/observed is all one totality. Not actually distinct.

Indeed. Control/manipulation is the doing. A movement of resistance/attachment/identification. An act of concentrated attention.

@Joseph MaynorOk

Sure, neither is watching

Watching/observing never ends. When it does back and forth bickering emerges Watching/observing is not clinging or a chore, it is love for life.

When everyone wins the lotto it looses its significance haha

It's trendy to be enlightened these days. Yesterday it was tight pants (skinny jeans) today it’s enlightenment