Etherial Cat

The men I am attracted to are generally very much in control of themselves, so even If the idea of having sex with a woman asleep would cross their mind I'm certain they wouldn't start groping them. I guess it's okay to some extend to wake up your partner for sex, but waking them up already performing sexual acts is creepy. You wont get me to change my mind. -- Right. I expected this answer to be fair. What I can tell is that I have also heard a lot of women who had this type of experience and did not take it well at all. It's possible that some might think there is nothing wrong with it, and perhaps some can even enjoy it, but the reaction is up to the person. Better be sure its in the whiter zone. Performing sex on someone while they sleep qualifies as a legal offense. It's better to make sure your partner is down for it. Claiming its fine and normal to do this is problematic. Especially after Emerald shared her story. Doing this basically diminsh her testimony by writing just down 'well, I touch girls in their sleep and they love it".

It's not okay to stimulate someone while they sleep. By definition, they can't give consent. It's also very unlikely that this person would take well during the day a direct stimulation without some warming ahead. This is taking advantage of the situation. Waking up to someone doing something to you is a traumatic cold shower. The person is most likely not horny at all and realize it is being objectified by someone it thought was safe to be around. It's selfish and rapey to feel horny and prey on an unconscious body.

If the person is open to share with you why it doesn't feel like engaging further with you, then you can shoot for it. But the rule is : this person doesn't owe you an explanation. If he/she does it, it's already an extra. It tells you that this person is not into you. Whatever its reasons are. And that person's reasons are not your problem. It's not personal. What bullshit narratives?

Bruh. I 100% agree that Edward Cullen and Christian Grey's are absolute psycho. I can guarantee you that If a guy confuses me for its potential dinner and feel an urge to kill me, I'm not interested ?. When I said that they are hot, I was merely talking about the actor's physics. Young, good looking and 6 packs. That's it.

You're right about the learning curve. As long as there is some progress, I'm very content! Yeah, you might have a point when it comes to my tendency to speak from the heart. I didn't realize it, but there is definitely a lot of heartly talk oozing from me. I like to see myself as a rational- mind oriented creature as well. But sometimes, I just want to explain things for a heart perspective when I feel like the mind perspective is trapped into some masturbation or the information doesn't circulate fast enough in this way.

At the end of the day, the rejection itself is the only answer you need. It tells more about the other person than it tells about you. It's just not a match. Both subjectivities do not align. But the person has the choice to reject you or not. Loving someone is respecting its free-will... You can't be angry at someone for refusing to accept you when you do the same right after. You're rejecting as poorly the rejection, and it shows that there is no healthy dynamic happening there. You're coming off as very needy and conditional, coming from this perspective. Yet, I get that the reason why is that you feel deeply hurt and you really want affection. But your emotions seems to kind of have festered and turned into anger. Working on this could really help, I think. I had already done it. I have spent a lot of time studying responsibility within the academic context (law school/philosophy), so I'm having a hard time combining your take on it with my perspectives on the subject.

Thank you. I've learned a lot through reading other forum members, especially @Emerald. She's the real master of the craft. Unfortunatelly, I do get hostile from time to time. I always see it as a failure when this happens. I still have a lot to learn before I'm satisfied with the way I engage with other fellow human beings.

Oh? Are we responsible as well for an injury if it's not realized? If you don't think women are wronging you, then why are you asking for responsibility? I think it's just likely that you haven't been thinking through the concept of responsibility and I'm pointing stuff that are flying over your head here. Also, I don't think you mean responsibility in the way you defined it. If you proceed to a subsumption and replace it by "ability to respond" or "the choice to do something" it doesn't make any sense.

Not in the context induced by your post. The responsibility you talked about was an accountability type, similar to what one asks after being done wrong by someone. It has nothing to do with the "ability to respond" or "choice to do something" you find within self-help. Your stawmaning my point.

Jesus. I find shocking to read something like this. ? Responsibility is something one has whenever one's fault or action has contributed to a loss. Do you want to hold women accountable for simply existing and having the right to chose what to do with their life/body? Your desire is for you to control. Don't deflect responsibility. Imagine if I were to offer you a plate of shit and hold you accountable for refusing to eat it? Your reasoning doesn't come far off from this.

You said wuuut ? C'mon Preety, this indeed sounds 100% mad. What you told him is that you don't value your life to the point you'd give it up for someone you've had a few conversations with. It also makes it scary to get involved in a relationship with you. It's starting extremely needy and intense. I'd see this as trouble and run.

Energetical wholeness in the world of form. Everything is a dance between the masculine and the feminine. The two polarities want to merge back as well through the human expression. Our psyche longs for a reintegration which often fails to be managed by the individual itself. Often in this case the energy throughout the whole body is out of balance. So It looks for it in the other polarities. But sex is also the ultimate play of that game.

Capital maximization. Society dreams of people who's got it all. Looks, success, money, and other social capital of all sort. Typically the average woman will want a man who's got it all. If you look at popular blockbuster (Twilight, 50 shades of grey... ?) the men are always hot and supposedly confident and charismatic. That creates insecurities for everyone. Hot Chad is embarrassed because he's not successful enough, Jeff Bezos because he's not good looking enough. Egos are always insecure. Wanting more is the default mode.

Yeah yeah... I'm already anticipating the next issue: being told I'm not acting feminine!

I have no problem with men approaching, but there are ways and reasons why they should approach me. I don't like it when a guy approaches me because he wants to approach any woman and I'll do the trick because I happen to be there. And that especially the case if he wants to straight up go on a date or something like that. It's a bit like if someone is applying for a job and try 1000 companies and see who gives them an answer. I'm very open with men approaching me when it comes to normal interactions though. This, I very rarely turn away. But if he's interest in me is a mere gender acknowledgment or an attraction to my flesh, I'm not interested. About Swiss men: I don't think weak is a fair adjective to talk about Swiss men. Mind you, as a Swiss woman I'm also not keen at all on making such a pejorative generalization about men whom some are my relatives, friends or acquaintances... Like the Israeli, Swiss men all go to the army. It is compulsory. I see their tasks (ranging from civil protection acts during Covid to special exercises that requires them to shoot to defend the borders or jumping from helicopters with bags) on a regular basis on social media. And for centuries, they have been praised for their exceptional warrior skills. When my Swiss male ancestors fought a battle, other European nations wanted them on their side. And that's why the French kings were defended by some Swiss knights, and the Pope is still guarded by Swiss guards. Also, I'm not sure if I'm proud of stating this but Julien Blanc from RSD is Swiss. So they definitely know pick up.

Each time there is a conscious boundary violation and they don't make amends or try to understand why I've been upset, I kinda have a break of trust/faith in that person I think. Then it depends if it makes the relationship still viable or that limitation makes it unfulfilling for both.

The same way you do when you feel threatened as a man by someone who overpowers you largely. Either you snap back at them (mostly possible if there are people around and they don't look totally batshit crazy- so there is a risk evaluation going on) or you shut up and try to make yourself small. I remember that once, when I was 17-18, a guy entered a bus and tried to kiss me right after. I told him to fuck off and let go of me. He threatened to slap me if I wouldn't apologize for that. I decided to apologize to avoid being beaten up (!!), but if I were a guy, I would have probably tried to make him lose all his teeth. Back then, I was so frail (46kg for 1m70) that I had just no other choice than to accept his condition to avoid a physical confrontation. -- Also, you'll notice that there is a difficult line between street harassment and a guy trying to pick up girls. Sometimes, I get afraid because a man stalks me or come very close to me. And I get relieved when I realize it's just the good old pick up and not a full stack psycho.

Yes, I totally agree. But then, does it still deserve the pick up appellation? Another thing that I don't like about pick up is that there is fundamentally manipulative element about it. Like an oddish desire for control. Also, it's mostly directed toward several women (like literally the art of chasing women). There is a factory farming style that I really dislike about it and find untrustworthy. I know! There are plenty of extraordinary men out there.

Yes. Boundary violation is probably one of the most common plague in our society. And you are totally right about female violating often emotional and psychological boundaries. Our biggest issue as a collective is that we all act more or less from needy perception and fail to see the needs of others. And it's how a lot of the social violence is perpetrated. What the world needs more is intimacy. The problem with a lot of men is that they aren't encourage to dive deep into their emotion and a lot of them lack emotional intelligence. And society (which is led mostly by misaligned masculine energy) teach men how to suppress their feminine side. So some of them become very bad at respecting boundaries.

I haven't been out in a while due to corona. This exemple was from last year. I also got flashed by a man in a park who showed me his dick while I was walking last September. He started masturbating in front of me. Men who hold incellish beliefs about women are more common than you'll know. Incels are an exaggeration, but males tend to spread crazy narrative and rumors about "how women are for real" and it misses a lot of the underlying reality behind. Yet, they are adamant that they are true.

Yes. I don't know if a good pick up artist would manage to be of any help with my emotional needs. I need people to be genuine, authentic and be interested in my welfare. Most pick up artist are just interested in lowering down your boundaries for a while and then will go hunt another girl. I'd say, I am too emotionally intelligent and sensitive for pick up to work. The pick up is only a facade that is hold for a while, until the guy shows his true face. I'm always interested in someone's true face at the get go.

Was it really that complex? Tldr : Men act often from needy perception, and do not perceive the subjectivity/needs of women and tend to trespass the boundaries consciously or unconsciously. That's also why a lot of woman complain about being "objectified". This is derived from "being not seen". Exemples: 1) I say the blackball/redpill is garbage. Right after that, a man comes and tell me that if I say that is because I'm a delusional femoid and my fate is to enjoy the cock carrousel in my 20s until I'll settle down for a beta cuck when I'll expire. I try to argue that none of my friends have been riding the cockcarousel in their 20 because we've all been in LTR. But still, blackpill it is ! I'm told my dream man is Chad psychopath and there is nothing to avoid my condition. <- My subjectivity is totally overruled by his insistance that I am how he imagine I am. Intimacy is not working. I can't feel good around this person and I close off. 2) I walk in the streets. A pick up artist comes to me and ask me to remove my headphone to have a chat. I clock him and we talk pick up. After a while of discussing pick up technics, he tries to test if I'm down to fuck by giving me a big hug. That's a technic see if I'm ready to get physical but I guess he didn't know I also knew about that one. It's corona time so I tell him I'm not interested. He still wants to test my receptivity and proceed anyway. <- My personal sovereignty is totally overruled by his desire to fuck. My boundary has been trespassed. I can't trust this person and I close off. I hope it's clear enough.

What is very common is that some men don't perceive you properly but the representation they've got in their head. It acts like a screen which precludes intimacy. And in this specific aspect becomes problematic because they come from a place where they expect things consciously or unconsciously, and their agenda doesn't fit your needs/well being. But they don't see the lag between the two aspects. It's almost like people like in parallel realities. And that's where a lot of boundary trespassing occurs. Illustration of this point goes from being flashed in a park to simply having conversations on the forum and being unrightfully unvalidated by individuals who unconsciously have a stake in you being wrong. So it's pretty wide. That said, men are not the only ones who act like that. Women do it also. But men are more difficult because they tend to be a dominant force in social context and they have a capacity to set the tone for what the standard perception is going to be. Men tend to have more potential for aggression and energy directed outwards, and when you do not conform to what they expect you to be, sometimes when their masculinity is shadowy they'll direct it at you and try to make you pay.

@soos_mite_ah I wish I had done it when I was around your age. I think it's a great idea ! Go for it! Have you tried Leo's life purpose course yet? I haven't read you mention it as far as I can see? @Emerald is a great coach. I'm not sure if she specializes in LP but she's awesome.

Hihi, sorry Shin. I anyway got to go. Gonna block the forum with Self-Control because I've got a pile of work to do.