TheAvatarState

But your core assumption is that awareness is the only thing that exists. Point to awareness. Where does it exist?

@cetus56 wow, seeing your comment made me read up on it more. Here's a colourised photo I found that's chilling:

@Vagos You're talking about an action not in alignment with the Way of Nature, something unnecessary and not close to Teotl. Something that directly affects other people, other "you"s, your own consciousness. Turquoise transcends and includes the lower stages. You can argue and deny all you want. The argument is as serious as you make it.

@Ampresus from your perspective, you are interested in consciousness work and know about the spiral. That immediately puts your value system in integral stage yellow. You want to move up the spiral in all areas and become a happier, healthier, more conscious person and that's great! From a RELATIVE Individual perspective such as yours, attaining higher stages is better, yes. You have the power and capacity and knowledge to do so. Now let's look at how Claire Graves used the model. He used it more of an objective way to model societies. Each society is where they are at because of the state of their government, economy, resources, religion etc. One of the main points of integral thinking is to stop culture war, and that means to see each society where they are at and not to blame each other. From a global perspective, no stage is better than the other because each stage is important and necessary. The problem with Green is that they try to inject green solutions to countries that are at blue or red, and it doesn't work. That's why this model is so important! All this model is about is high-level understanding and compassion. No stage is better than the other. You might ask, "then why are we trying to move up if no stage is better?" Not better, more advanced and evolved (through necessary steps and stages). We can't end culture war without having understanding and compassion to those at lower stages. We have to meet them where they're at. Does this make sense?

@CelticQueen17 Follow along with this video. Practice stripping away context and excess baggage from your direct experience. What if the Truth was all around you, but you just couldn't see it? What if you were the Truth? Yes, it seems outrageous. But if you think about it, if the Truth was really Absolute and irreducible, and let's say there was such a thing... How could it be anywhere else? How could it be... Anywhere?

@CreamCat ah, but the world out there is Objective! I have no influence on it! If I die the world keeps going, does it not? Whereas in a dream, if I die the dream goes with it.

@okulele @Maya_0 yeah I had a similar experience. I have an extremely close friend with whom I do most of my trips with, and it kind of "happened" one time where we literally merged consciousness and became one mind. That sounds kind of cool on the surface, but it was a literal nightmare for me. I would ask him "what do you want to do now?" and he would reply "what do you mean?" and so on and so on. Every conversation was a cycle because we both know what each other was thinking. I asked him his opinion on a piece of art, and it seemed to me he couldn't bring anything new to the table (at the time I did not understand we had merged consciousness, so this was quite scary). It went downhill fast because I was convinced that my friend was literally me and I had made him up. The weird part was he stayed grounded and wasn't that freaked out, but the experience turned into a nightmare for me. So be careful what you wish for. "we are all one" gets thrown around a lot, and that's cute on the surface. But to actually experience melding consciousness with someone else in real time is quite another. If you're not extremely prepared for such a thing (I wasnt), then you Will start thinking you went insane and everyone you've ever met is imaginary.

@CreamCat *this is how you commit murder consciously. * What are your thoughts on this statement? Edit: nvm I got the post

He could be Purple and do that, so it doesn't really say much about his stage in the spiral. They aren't really related.

@Highest

I'm sure of it too! You seem like a really laid back and chill guy. Again, I wasn't saying you WERE a zen devil, lol, I was just letting you know of a potential trap. It reminded me of a great passage in the book I just read, so I had to share. From your last message I can tell that you have the right perspective. There's a lot of technical information about the various plants he took, and it might seem like it's just a story and not applicable to you. However, there's a lot of deep wisdom in the book, you kind of just have to know where to look. I think you'll really enjoy it!

I'm sorry to say, but this is starting to look like zen devilry. Be careful... It's often when you think you're the most "protected" by your consciousness of the nondual that you're actually most vulnerable to your egoic desires. Carlos Casteneda talked about this in The Teachings of Don Juan. There are 3 obstacles for a man on the path of knowledge. The first is fear. I believe you have overcome that, as you are conscious of nonduality (God). The second obstacle is actually the hard-won prize from defeating the first obstacle: clarity. You can rely on your clarity so much that you use it in places that you shouldn't. To overcome clarity, one should almost look at it as if a mistake. Question everything about it. Learn when to use it and when not to. Stay humble. This is part of the sage's path. If you stop here, you will surely be defeated. If you happen to overcome the second obstacle, clarity, then you will be faced with the final boss: power. A man who fully succumbs to power will be permanently defeated. You must have a teotlized heart by this point, able to withstand any temptation. Notice that you are not safe or free from responsibility at any part of this journey. You ARE a sage whether you like it or not, and there are real dangers along the path.

So I'm rewatching Leo's "what is actuality" video and it's hitting me really hard. I had a couple of great insights, but they were kind of horrifying and startling. I'd like to share those with you. Every single friend you think you've had or do have is actually an imaginary friend. We unconsciously construct libraries of context around people we interact with. And of course we kind of have to in order to interact with others. Body language, facial expressions, etc are actually a second Language (symbols) to us. I can guarantee you that you've never seen what's actual when a person speaks to you, that is, stripped bare of all social and metaphysical context and meaning. Notice that when you talk to someone, you're not talking to an actual person, you're talking to a complex idea of a person. That you constructed. Every friend you've ever had is imaginary. The second insight came when I was trying to actually explore the question "what is actuality?" I thought, so if looking at your hand is actual, then would looking at someone else's hand also be actual? What if you looked at a picture of your own hand (of course this would add another layer of complexity by trying to strip the context of what image is on the paper from the actual paper and ink). I kept going down this rabbit hole of trying to get to the bottom of what is actual, thinking I was being really clever, until of course it dawned on me. Wait... What is all this but more concept and imagination? I operated under the logic that the words "looking at my hand" pointed to an actual experience I could have, but my blunder was that I was going through these scenarios in my head, and that "an actual experience I could have" cannot be quantified or thought about! When I had this epiphany, I was like "holy shit! Leo isn't joking!" In fact, the whole endeavor was completely pointless. So, how would I answer my original question: what is actuality? Of course it's ultimately pointless like I described above, but it's still helpful. Well this is super tricky now, because I can't try to describe "a real experience I could have" now can I? That already says way too much, it's misleading, and it comes with way too much baggage. What about "everything?" That's closer I guess, but it comes with the baggage of there being an objective universe, and you can't see everything so you start to create concepts of what you think everything to be. What about "nothing?" Oooo, maybe we're getting somewhere! Nothing immediately dispels visualization. Nothing is an inward dive into the void, while everything is an outward search. We've all heard "God is nothing." Is this the closest we can get with words and symbols? If you have any ideas on this, please let me know! Now to go look at my hand...

The ultimate tip for being deluded and ignorant is to know for a fact you're not deluded and ignorant! ???

@Tony 845 there are many levels to awakening. I'd say that most people on the forum have awakened to some level, but if you're talking about high levels of awakening/full embodiment of enlightenment, then there are few on the entire planet. A few thousand at most, perhaps. This is no small feat!

@Homer definitely what sahil says, the only way is to be a positive influence, go on hikes, subtlely bring up deeper topics. Talk about your consciousness practices, meditation, etc and the benefits. There are many awesome benefits that even stage orange people can recognize. Don't be forceful, just be cool and be a good example. That is enough. Also, I noticed another forum member "highest" from Norway just posted a thread asking for a meet up! Might be awesome to connect with another forum member that's really into spirituality and nonduality. Peace

@Rashid one thing I've noticed with psychedelics with other consciousness work is that I have greater awareness and ability to disconnect from pain. I would highly recommend doing the Wim Hof method, meditation, and nuutropics. Psychedelics aren't necessary, and there's another opposing side effect Ive noticed with raising consciousness. You stop seeing sports in the same light. Competition becomes meaningless. If you're doing athletics for your own personal growth and fitness, this won't be a problem. But if your athletics is part of sports, is competitive... Perhaps you shouldn't dive into 5-meo. Lol

@Ook

@Shadowraix and that's with rational people! Imagine how hard it would be to talk to pre-rational people, stage red and blue? I mean, you don't really have to imagine, just look in history. The good news is that society is able to take on new ideas and paradigms at an ever increasing rate. The majority of people will move into green in our lifetimes, with a significant portion moving into yellow. And yellow is the magical point; tier 2. Awareness of all stages of the spiral. Once a significant part of society reaches yellow (doesn't have to be a large percentage), innovation and creativity will burst in all directions like we've never seen before. So that's at least something to look forward to

1. Myself 2. Leo Gura 3. My best friend irl 4. Rupert Spira 5. Alan Watts This list is of course assuming "who's" and not" what's"

@Charlotte cheers! Sounds great!

@Charlotte my best trips ever were a low_medium dose in national parks. Somewhere extremely beautiful, within a short distance of your car, and away from people.

You being able to say this means that you're not actually deluded or ignorant. Chin up, OK?

@Shin you found my secret (there is no spoon)

@Amun @Amun Who is "I"?