White

@Ether I use self inquiry all day when i don't have to attend to externals. I don't sit in a pose or formally meditate. I just do the practice when I can because the identification is always there all the time. I also value thinking and categorizing, in my experience its essential to understand development because it makes It a lot easier to see where you are stuck. It doesn't cause me problems, in fact it's made me more accepting of myself and others which is a good thing. I suffer sometimes but that's part of life, but the way I experience myself is just because there is suffering doesn't mean one can't be at peace with it. I know you don't like concepts, but getting away from concepts is not always healthy. How many perspectives you can hold all at once in your mind determins how easy it will be to eventually learn to let go of them

@Ether If there is any time you're not in a non dual experience then pure awareness has identified with ether again. If you ask yourself right now who you are you will say you are ether - correct?

@7thLetter what is the issue then? You've answered your question

@Ether ok. so that's it. You have experiences and then you become identified with your thoughts again. That's it, you have to constantly chip away at the constant re-identification. You can't just have an experience and stop there because the identification is stronger than you are at this point. So your goal should not be a non dual experience, your goal should be the process of self inquiry.

@Ether when you stumble upon that realisation it's not just a concept you are telling yourself, is it? You're not asking what am I and then answering "I'm nothingness" are you?

@7thLetter just because you learn to accept something as it is doesn't mean you put up with it. It depends where you're at on your journey. If you're starting out with all kinds of neurosis you will want to get away and get that handled so that your core becomes stronger. Later on you might feel a need to enter back into those environments to help others through it as part of your life purpose. That will indeed show you a thing or two. You have to consider the context before just saying this is right and this is wrong. Yes get the hell out of a rotten situation if you can't cope with it.

@Ether ok. There is only one topic when it comes to the self inquiry I'm speaking of: question: at this point in time what do you take yourself to be?

@Rilles he might be embracing all kinds of hippie stuff, I only listen to his chats with Rhonda Patrick and he's not very critical of mainstream science: that tells me a lot. ORANGE and probably flirting with some green ideas. But he's definately not blue. No way is he yellow.

@stevegan928 Joe Rogan is orange

@Ether what were those conclusions?

@Leo Gura Leo, is It possible that blue could use yellow concepts to justify their judgements of "right vs. wrong"?

I would not describe anything as intense. I'm content and my work is very enjoyable because I'm so calm and peaceful. Sometimes I get distracted, but those are times I take my attention off of myself. The secret is I am not overly concern with the outside world, i just keep inquiring into my identification with who I believe I am. It's easy - it is focusing on the world that brings turmoil. I have a journal that shows you how to do it. If you like you can look at it. It's very simple

I know I'm not Leo but I can answer, the kid won't go straight to yelllow, it will successfully navigate all stages and inhabit yellow at the end of higher education. It will be less fucked up as a 1st tier child because it has been allowed to transition all the stages and complete them successfully with more even development and no split off sub personalities begging for attention.

Ego is pure awareness that is deluded by identification with "this" or "that". The higher up the spiral you go the less identification with "this" or "that". When Wilber talks of empty space he's talking about the ego freed from limitation - I am, prior to this or to that. He uses the same definition for ego as Ramana Maharshi. I don't believe that traditional horizontal enligtenment states where the ego "dies" is true enlightenment. I think that's just a state experience in time. Vertical enlightenment more important and that's a transcend and include instead of straight ego death.

@Viking maybe you're just a bit depressed because your doing self development? It's not like your not present, but maybe you're just transitioning and your mind is in chaos and your body doesn't want to work so hard because you are letting go of making meaning. Personal development is painful chaotic and messy. I know you want an answer to your perceived problem, but for you I don't think there is one. Just keep doing what you need to do to make a living and try to inhabit an attitude of not just looking at your 5 year plan, but focus on what actions are going to have an impact on you when you retire. Be present as much as you can but don't mistake that for throwing caution to the wind and letting go of all rationality. The point is to enjoy now but to set your life up in such a way that your future now's don't turn into a nightmare. Grin and bear it and learn to be with the discomfort instead of trying to fix it. The fact you think you can always escape suffering is an indication you're resisting suffering. Things have to be destroyed to make way for new things to emerge. It's not always plain sailing, learn to live with it because I think you have a mindset that you shouldn't ever be suffering or depressed or regressing. That's a bit of a trap.

Thank you. I think you should start a journal with all this so anyone who wants to can study in depth.

I just watched a quick ted talk of Rupert sheldrake. Yes, still trying to make an even more elaborate map of reality. Questioning existing dogmas but at the same time creating a dogma if his own. It's like, he knows the map is not the territory, but he's attempting to make a map of that insight. Turquoise is like a bulb that's flickering between power and blowing

@Zweistein no nuances or shades of greys? It's just "everyone who gives advice has that particular problem themselves". No middle ground? It's just either/ or?

@Joseph Maynor Thank you for linking the Lennon interview. I haven't seen this one. X

I feel a troll coming on. HELP! I need somebody... HELP!

@Joseph Maynor sorry. I don't believe in wrong or right. I believe in love But go ahead with your judgements.. whatever gets you thru the night...

@Joseph Maynor Ok. But what's that got to do with self actualization/spirituality?

@The White Belt in live in my van and i mostly spend my time in areas of outstanding natural beauty . It's bliss internet signal is ropey and I have to go to the gym to shower. Apart from that it's incredible for meditation..i am on the verge of being a yogi

@egoeimai integrate it, don't let it turn into a belief tho . A belief will lead to regressive self protection and integration and forgiveness will lead to wisdom