Surfingthewave

@Ella Lovely post thank you. Once a seeker always a seeker. Absolutely I do see the Truth, but terrifying as all my life I have been searching. To no longer have that sense of lack, to no longer search is mind blowing. @hamedsf It's the concepts meeting what is, mad.

I can relate to this. This has been a key step in the journey. It feels a bit like stumbling out of the dark and into the light, my eyes are still adjusting to this beauty. @Leo Gura thank you I am, and back at you. @Aaron p Going home is a good metaphor, it certainly feels more familiar the deeper we go.

@Aaron p To release deep events in the mind unconscious thoughts? I've no idea.

@vander87 what a refreshing post. I do think there is something in wanting to be your 'best sexuality' and the survival of the self in that. As this has connotations with division and competition, perhaps it could be more about your most 'authentic sexuality' and surviving by that, whatever that it. You then burst the bubble of cultural norms as you are living your most authentic self and if you are an enlightened being than that will pave the way for others. @possibilitiesit is very healthy to follow more than one teacher, I think the more the better as it dispels the myth of cult leadership and you are able to detatch more from what is being said rather than just following blindly. I think this rings true with the morality of sexuality, people are following blindly what they think is the norm instead of searching for their authentic self/sexuality. If you don't struggle with this you won't take a second thought to this. Many people have taken their own lives in the past because of this issue so again, it does come back to the survival of the best self.

Good quote although I'll pass on Miley. She's not a philosopher I particularly follow. Is this a double entendre? The path is rich with love but also rich with loss. Loss of self.

And how are you doing with that?

@How to be wise Really, I wonder why.

Good idea. Aha! This is where the do nothing techique gets you. And this is is the point, it's like a metaphor for life. You sit with the numbness until you can no longer bear it (of course risk asses first with positions etc). Shinzen Young claims you won't do any real damage (unless you're sitting for like hours and hours). The numbness is resistance to life. Let go of the resistance, keep letting go and see what happens.

@Sunny J Gupta 1 hour seems to be my limit at the moment.

@Fede83 I had the same problem for a while. I found that the more I was meditating I was permeating layers and layers of emotions, deep issues and thoughts.These come to the surface as you let them go and seemingly played havoc with my sleep.

@possibilities Thank you for your nuanced insights. You are able to articulate points I wasn't able to. I think you have raised some key points about Leo as a teacher, learning from this and learning from some of the blind spots he may have as we all have. I think that is to do reflecting on what are his views, the self's own views, and views that are made on behalf of collective ego, or devilry, which he has observed. You also made some key points about devilry, consciousness, the self and also about God. If God is outside of survival, where does that leave the self? Where does that leave the moralisation of sexuality?

@Nahmthank god for you

@RendHeaven Thank you I appreciate the sentiment. I've enjoyed discussing this with you. I do get your insights on survival, I'm just not there yet. We all have blind spots

@RendHeaven Every heard the term mansplaining? Well I got a triple dose of that here. I take a lot of your points but I feel uncomfortable by the "you seem" "you do" and "you know". I'm not demanding anything or claiming to know anything, who does, right? I'm just expressing my views. There seems to be a lot of projection there from you, so I will leave this discussion there, it feels like it has arrived at a natural end.

I like the Rupert Spira quote about love and relationships. He says the best thing you can say to your partner is I love you but I don't need you. He's right. To fully embody love you need to transcend it. To have an amazing fulfilling gratifying relationship you let your partner go (not literally but to let go of your attachment to that person) because like everything in life as I've realised through deep inner work, nothing can make you truly happy. Relationships included. A lot of women and men peg their happiness on finding love, the right relationship to complete the whole, when actually this isn't needed. We are already complete. Yes there are cultural norms around women and men but if we're talking about averages and trends - I live in a place where there are much more alternative relationships as @Jed Vassallo and @vander87 described. Just because something is average why is it the norm? And why should we use this as a benchmark for acceptance? I care about these norms but they don't apply to my life at all. Perhaps both men and women feel pressurised into these norms in terms of sex and relationships because of the existence of such social constructs when in fact these social constructs are bottomless (excuse the pun). I get the whole survival debate but frankly, it's a cop out. Yes we do these things to survive but we're more nuanced than that and more non dual than that.

Absolutely, the first point is spot on, I do have fears around my sexuality because I'm not entirely heterosexual and I don't want to "lock down a man". What's wrong with raising consciousness as a way to solve deep rooted issues? Do you see how the points you are making (based on what, your own experience? ) form the basis of false beliefs and ultimately cultural norms. For example you use the terms pick up (in previous posts) and locking down a man - can you see how these terms degrade women? I realise language is powerful and your points are relative but be careful. Sex and relationships can be beautiful and loving and can be an expression of what it means to be human. Morality and false beliefs (as well as survival) has made the appearance of sexuality sneaky and manipulative as you so describe.

I'm curious to know how general statements come about, as they appear to become cultural values if enough people believe in them for a significant amount of time. For example the free love movement of the sixties was only a movement, however, but it was able to blast though some cultural norms such as of no sex before marriage and the oppressive nature of family values of the fifties (women having to become housewives etc). You mention the consensus, the problem that I have is it's actually fear based rather than what people actually believe. It is also deeply rooted in religion and politics. People fear difference, or anything outside the norm so society will do anything they can to keep things the status quo. In relation to your other points above, women group together and discuss sex it's just not done in the way you describe men do. The work needed is of course raising consciousness. This will then lead to the break down of cultural norms, the end to gender roles when it comes to sex and the deep rooted moralisation of sexuality. I'm being very optimistic of course!

I think you do. Why even make a point about it, you wouldn't if it was a man. Does he? Who says? If you raise the consciousness levels of society these cultural values won't exist. Sorry @SaWaSaurus I've taken over your thread. But clearly we still have a lot of work to do to deconstruct the moralisation of sexuality.

Can you explain this point? Do you mean sex workers, rather than sluts.

I get that sexuality has a survival /transactional function and agree that ultimate aim is to transcend this. Yes sex is valuable to us to advance the self, there is also a deeply spiritual function to sexuality, regarding connection, love and transcendence of the self which can be expressed through sex. Perhaps it's not just about sticking your dick in trees? I don't agree that a woman's value in society is directly tied to her reproductive potential, we've moved away from that in the past 50 years. @possibilities I'm not quite sure I quite get some of your points however I do agree there is so much conditioning when it comes to sex. Also desire is what makes us human, it makes us move towards our goals in life and hopefully to meet that partner a lot of us long for. There is also an underlying desire not to be alone, which serves a survival function and and forms part of the moralistic view on sexuality.

@Leo Gura How have you arrived at this view or are you stating this is what the collective ego projects? There in lies the problem. Absolutely it is about survival, so how do we change these deeply moralistic views?

Great post @SaWaSaurus. I live in the UK so I can't comment on the US but I agree with you about the deep rooted moralisation of sexuality being influenced by religious doctrines particularly Christianity. Absolutely @Apparation of Jack this is further strengthened by popular western culture, the constant depiction of heterosexual relationships, objectification of women etc etc. Here in the UK (near where I live) we are seeing a move away from this which is massive progress. Same sex relationships are accepted more and more and people are realising marriage isn't for everyone. Also it does depend on where you live, polygamy is more prevelant in certain cultures. If sex was discussed more openly then yes, I think this really would impact of people's happiness and also relationships (just take a look at the sexuality part of this forum). I do think sex education in school plays a massive part (or lack there of) mine was shit, pretty much non existent. This is a huge problem because we learn as children not to talk openly about sexuality or relationships.

@kieranperez Shedding deep unconscious psychological issues does get you closer to the Truth, but it comes at a price. It is like breaking through the very foundations of your being, as I have experienced. Sometimes you do need a good therapist to help with this process. Particularly if your family /close ones are unsupportive or seemingly reacting in such a negative way. I'm wary of discussing actualized.org topics with close ones, as you are indirectly challenging their beliefs as well as your own.

@kieranperez The fact that you have opened up shows how authentic you are and how much progress you are making. Perhaps this is the deepest difficulty you face, similar to Leo. He has made massive progress by being more authentic. People do understand but everyone is on their own path at different points, and will have their own triggers and struggles, I know I do. This forum can be a difficult place to express yourself and get a good debate going, because it is, just a forum, and not a face to face discussion. I wish you all the best and keep doing what your doing. Also I just wanted to add, I've unearthed some deep subconscious issues of my own on the cushion, which have been life changing so don't underestimate it's power.

@kieranperez Sorry to get pedantic but perhaps you need to think more about meeting girls and talking to them in real life, rather than how you imagined, as no matter how enlightened you think you are, or how real you would like your thoughts to be, I'm afraid to say it's never going to happen as you so imagined.