Donald

@Leo Gura Is this book "similar" to My Big TOE by Tom Campbell? In my opinion the latter is a very good book to challenge worldviews . I always wonder how can I integrate what I get from this kind of books in my daily life . I've read Bohm and still I need to digest Campbell ? , but they have the tendency to shock and confuse the hell out of me . How can I get the most out of this books ?

THOUGHT IS NEVER NEW

@John Try different timings . Throughout a week try to meditate in different times of the day and stick with what's best for you . Experiment!!! In my own experience the best time for me is 4 - 6 pm .And I had to get a lot of "stressful sitings" only because I thought that to meditate in the morning is better .

@Juan Cruz Giusto the subconscious is made of the same substance as the conscious, which is thought.

Most of Freud's Ideas are out dated , it will confuse the hell out of you reading him . @Juan Cruz Giusto Why are dreams so important? Why you want to interpret them?

Undivided Wholeness in Flowing Movement- just love that phrase from Bohm?

Your daily routine is part of the problem. Your environment , your friends and family . Change is difficult when your environment does not change. Stop beating yourself and understand that this is a challenge that requires time ( maybe years and decades)

@Shin Be consistent with this technique and keep in mind - be careful of daydreaming .

@JustinS Rupert Spira is one of the most clear and no bullshit dudes

@ajasatya What do you mean by silence ? A gap between 2 thoughts, silence after a noise ? The problem is that we have a preconceived idea of everything. What you are saying is not stillness, it is an idea of stillness.

The sun shines light to the earth and the moon ,but never to itself. Contemplate with that ... Awareness is like that light. It can be directed on objects , but not to itself

@ajasatya What do you mean "still" ? Still - Rigid -Not Moving - ? Imagine a pile of wood in the river , the pile is sitting still , it is not moving and it is rigid . Stillness... Except the fact that the whole river is crushing the pile . Now imagine the same pile flowing in the river . The pile is not moving, it is in stillness related to the river . Something so simple such as stillness, or better our idea of what stillness is .

Self improvement doesn't point to the truth , and it's not even a big deal , it just feels better. Your body , your mind , your relationships and so on . REMEMBER : We are consciousness being experienced through a body , not a body with consciousness.

It's one thought versus another thought !!! If you pay more attention, you will notice that when you beat yourself up by saying "I should be a good person " that is just a thought . It's like mind fighting itself. "I want to be a good person " Why? "Because I like to feel accepted " Why? And on and on ... be honest with yourself

Shadow work , in other words be fucking honest with yourself. The idealistic image you have of yourself , the things that you don't like about yourself and the should-s you keep repeating. Let go of it , forget about Leo about enlightenment, being good and so on . If you behave narcissistically in a given situation, just observe , don't judge just let it go .You and your desires are one , they are not separate.

Just finished reading Krishnamurti's book and wanted to share some quotes that I got from him . If you don't know who this dude is , he was closely related to David Bohm and influenced Bohm in his works .Having read Bohm's books and works ,reading K is really so enjoyable . His insights are really helpful for anyone who is doing enlightenment work . -"There is silence between two notes , between two thoughts , between two movements and so on . We are not talking about that quality of silence , because they are temporary , they go away . We are speaking of silence that is not produced by thought , that is not cultivable , that comes only when you have understood the whole movement of existence " -"Thought cannot create psychological order because thought itself is disorder , because thought is based on knowledge , is based on experience .All knowledge is limited , and so thought is also limited , when thought tries to bring order , it brings about disorder.Thought has created disorder through the conflict between "what is" and "what should be" , the actual and the theoretical .Thought looks at the actual from a limited point of view .and therefore its action must inevitably create disorder." -"Thought is movement in time because is the response of knowledge , experience , memory is time . So thought can never be still .Thought can never be new " -" If I force my mind to be still , through various tricks and practices , shocks then it is the stillness of a mind that has struggled with thought , controlled thought , suppressed thought .That is entirely different from a mind which has seen the activity of the self , seen the movement of the thought as time " -"When you see that , that thinker is the thought , the controller is the controlled , the observer is the observed , then there is no movement .One realizes anger is part of the observer who says ,"I am angry", so anger and the observer are the same. In the same way the thinker who want to controls thought is still thought .When one realizes that , the movement of thought stops "

@Wendelin K is great but if you give his works to the average "actualized" dude they will not understand it , it will seem dull , slow and repetitive. (Had experienced myself before) @Frogfucius You are right , there has been given so much importance to the "no thought" state of mind , which is is why enlightenment sounds sexy and romantic. It is just a de-conditioning, you stop seeing yourself as a separate entity , that's it .The sky is still gonna have clouds after you "become" it . Shit will happen after you "reach" it , thoughts will arise , anger and emotions. The only "difference " is that you don't register the shit in your brain . If we say thinking and thoughts, we must say also feeling and felts ( just use that word ) . Now feeling is something which is based on direct experience , right ? But when you register it in your brain, it becomes a "felt" . Now next time when you will have again the same direct experience, your little brain will go boom mechanically , giving you the feeling which you had before. So your doing things mechanically. That's why all the " enlightened " folks keep on saying things like : "knowledge is limited "bla bla . Thoughts and feelings are the same thing the influence one another.

@Wendelin K is great but if you give his works to the average "actualized" dude they will not understand it , it will seem dull , slow and repetitive. (Had experienced myself before)

@Vytas This quotes are just the tip of the iceberg , in order to understand this topic better read the following : 1 D.Bohm -Wholeness and Implicate Order 2 D.Bohm -Thought as a system 3 J.Krishnamurti- This light in oneself for me it's like a triology

I'm not advocating " no control " or "no improvement" .

To have a choice implies to have a chooser, which again is nonsense !!! And you still again use the words " happy " , "happier" , "improvement " . Now you might say what is the problem , because they are just word not the thing , right? The problem is psychological "time " , psychological "movement " wanting to go somewhere.( perfection ) . Life is not moving from imperfection to perfection, you see. It is so simple ...

The problem is that your mind thinks of infinity something like what is being shown by "Hubble Space Telescope"

Try in your own experience the following Look at an object , ( lamp ) . Who is looking at the lamp ? Answer this in your direct experience , don't rush !!! I recommend you do this after your meditation practice , so that the mind will be less conditioned . Where does the looking happen ? Is the activity , the looking different from what you think "looks" at the object . Once again don't rush , don't look for an answer .You see the separate self looks at an object and it goes towards the object , on the other hand awareness point of view is just allowing the object to arise in the field of experience , it doesn't go toward the object , there is no direction in awareness . "You" and what is being perceived are the same , it is just a matter of conditioning . When it comes to thoughts we are being conditioned to believe that thoughts are different from feelings , when in fact are the same process .It is important to understand this , so if a feeling arises ( urge to look at the clock ) Thought goes ' Shit I Must Control It ' .It is thought fighting thought (feeling ) . That's why there is a tremendous error here , and that's why it has been given an enormous importance to awareness / observation / attention because the solution can come only when you are aware of the absurdity of thought . If you understand the movement of thought , boom that's it , your conditioning is gone . Enjoy the day !!!

The most important thing to understand is psychological time , wich is the movement of thought . You see , when we sit to meditate we say " I should let my mind free " and so you go and assume that you are letting it free . But if you give a closer look , what you really need to do is just observe the mind. Thought will give you the info that there is the 'observer' and the 'observed' , but that itself is thought . When you say I will let go of control , that implies the 'I' and the 'thought' wich are the same . "I will let go " is time , it is psychological time .\Try to observe whatever is there , if a sense of urge arises ( curiosity to see what the clock number is ) just observe that and be aware of it don't try to change it just observe it ,

check Adyashanti's "True Meditation "