electroBeam

That's an extreme example but Very easily Osho could not have been aware of the complexities of capitalism, because it take study to see it unlike mysticism. Its not just obvious by walking in the streets. And you can still be deeply loving and deeply unaware of those hidden complexities. But I think you're saying that you should study those complexities otherwise there's something not quite right about you. Yeah really not sure about that. Got nothing to add to the discussion at this point because im not sure. I feel like ultimately mysticism and direct experience is prior to intellectual understandings of the complexities of capitalism, and direct experience and mysticism is prior because capitalism is imaginary and not true, so I value the former more. But that may change in the future if I ever get to post awakening and decide to ride the ox a certain way. Or maybe not. I think infinite love has a component here, you feel a desire to heal the world because of infinite love, and that may feed into wanting to stop nazis taking over your land. But that feeling is totally dependent on whether you're educated enough to know the problems in the first place. Infinite love doesn't guarantee that you'll automagically feel an urge to reduce capitalism. Only if you somehow become aware of it (which to become aware of that stuff you need to do worldly things like reading books and talking to people, not meditation or awakening work). The discussion with me and Leo gives a great explanation. There's lots of mystical stuff happening in my experience on a daily basis, but spiral dynamics wise, I find I'm closest to blue/orange, although due to how deconstructed my worldview is, I don't really resonate with any particular stage on the spiral. I resonate very very well with the experiences of the accounts of Jesus, Chogyam Trungpa, zen teachers and shamans. Very timeless, eternal, non linear. And those teachers are blue. I don't resonate much with green teachers like Matt Khan, Adyshanti, mooji, etc. My spiritual style is very aggressive like Peter Ralstone. So that's why I generally peg myself as blue. Its hard to peg myself without comparing myself to the experiences of teachers, because on a daily basis, my perspective isn't very worldly. Its very timeless, eternal, magical/mystical, etc. And I don't really feel a strong repulsion to being blue either. Because I'm so detached from worldly things, and so immersed in bliss and a perspective that's very open and released, that there's no passion or dispassion towards my values. My values are sort of like just ordinary things I don't really think or care about, like dust on your desk.

Yeah that's development completely unrelated to awakening IMO. The awakened had to surrender so much, that such questions would probably feel like asking "what's the best way to swing a golf club"

@Leo Gura Yeah ok, they probably got it from culture, never thought of that. Bashar though is definitely different hahaha. I can't imagine him saying Derek Chauvin is an awful guy for shooting that black guy. I think he would look at the scenario and a big "I cannot compute..." would happen.

Don't get cocky here. You're still identified with an ego, even if your ego doesn't believe it. It arises but conscious effort to not listen to them can occur. Be careful not to be a wild fox zen. Don't spout non dual philosophy without feeling it. If you truly feel like you're in control, then take that as fact rather than trying to one up yourself by believing the non dual philosophy over what you feel is true.

Yeah but whether Newtonian mechanics is important is relative to your worldview. Newtonian mechanics is completely useless for shamans or reiki healers. And whether newtonian mechanics are 'real' is totally dependent on your perspective. Some perspectives see newtonian mechanics as valid, while others don't. Whether someone is off the charts or not is completely dependent on your perspective and what you decide to dream up. You can project whatever you want. For some, Padmasambhava or Jesus may be on the charts, for others he's not. I personally don't recognise Padmasambhava as being on the charts based on his story and life. I see him as being completely undefined SD wise.

But what's confusing is there are some enlightened people who are just so deep in enlightenment that they just can't comprehend being racist. Like Bashar. He's so high in the sky, talking about aliens and stuff, that I don't think he can even comprehend being racist. Or capitalist. He's broken down and deconstructed his paradigm so much that he doesn't comprehend the basis of racism. Because his worldview is so broken and deconstructed. Same with other teachers. Like adyshanti and sadhuguru and matt khan. And this goes with my experience aswell, if you contemplate enough as part of your spiritual journey, and just keep deconstructing, you forget how to be racist. Because you've deconstructed race as part of your spiritual process of shedding ego. I'm aware that there are spiritual teachers who are racist, and maintain their social programming, but somehow it doesn't happen with all teachers.

In the relative sense (your perspective) no. No end to it. It just comes down to not listening to thought and ego. All suffering is caused by your perspective and listening to ego and identifying with ego. Salvation is accessible to you right now, but you must do exactly what you don't want to do. And that's why you suffer. Are you looking to not suffer? Well THE ANSWER is to simply not listen to thought. To not believe thought. But can you do that? Chances are, if you're suffering and aren't enlightened yet, then you probably can't. So no one on here can save you, even if we tell you exactly what to do.

As you said, it depends on your level of consciousness. You can think of it as 2 parallel universes going on at once. From one perspective, Jesus is a crude neanderthal. From another, he is operating at a level where he is actually using his understanding of timelessness, eternity, infinite love etc to live a good life and help others. Which is extremely beyond crude. And its not like the 2nd perspective builds on top of the 1st. Its like an optical illusion, where the both exist at the same time. The first perspective is no truer than the 2nd. Which is why I don't really get the value of going up the ladder of spiral dynamics, when it breaks down anyway through meditation. And the new perspective or life you have after it breaks down is so much more cooler than going up a stage.

But what if you were trying to analyse Jesus's values for a school assignment. And completely forget about the mysticism aspects of him (or completely deny them if you're an academic). He must have some values right? There must be some sort of SD conclusion you can project with some accuracy or conviction? Or maybe not. Maybe where you peg Jesus actually depends on your level of development. If you're the pope, you peg him at blue, if you're more awake, you peg him at a different point in the spiral because you recognise the more mystical aspects of him. Oh right maybe that's what you mean by SD assumes everyone is at a particular baseline of consciousness.

I was making a point from a holistic standpoint. Not based on some 1 liner Leo said for a couple of seconds in a 2 hour long video. Don't take things so literally. I'm not attacking Leo, my question was to further understand where Leo was getting at with mysticism and spiral dynamics. If you actually watch the video, and actually look at his post in the turquoise mega thread, 60% of turquoise according to him is highly related to mysticism. Non dual experiences, paranormal phenomena, etc. Stuff which the original model doesn't talk about. And even if Leo doesn't conflate the 2, his fanbase definitely does, and I take the general collective perception of his fanbase into account, along with what he says personally, because it derives more implicit understanding about what spiral dynamics is, and how it affects behaviour on a collective level. Making a wider point that spiral dynamics is meant to be dropped around tier 2. Gotcha. How did I miss integral theory, only looked at it briefly but it aligns very well with my experience. That's a model I have to study. I'm curious about the paradox of the non linear and linear aspects of waking up in relation to the spiral. You're implying that once you get above a certain stage, waking up starts to ramp up in intensity: so a linear progression from growing up to waking up. Yet there is also a non linear aspect, because you can wake up at any time on the spiral. Once you experience timelessness, this point becomes interesting. And what's interesting is, spiral dynamics is a great predictor for how worldviews work on a worldly level from a particular perspective, but then completely breaks down from another perspective. And its both a great predictor for how things work, and completely breaks down, simultaneously. For example, spiral dynamics makes complete sense for how stage blue societies worked in India. From a worldly perspective. Yet if you read stories about how enlightened beings (tantra in particular) behaved. Their behaviour is completely undefined from the spiral, for example the story of Padmasambhava. And if you've got any experience with enlightenment, you actually understand and have lived the perspective of enlightened beings like Padmasambhava (once you experience eternity, immortality, no ego, timelessness, etc) And seeing those 2 perspectives (SD and enlightenment perspective) work simultaneously is interesting. Anyway, I'm just being a nerd. This stuff isn't practical or important for most people.

Yet those are the countries with the biggest populations.

there's no such thing as an asshole being rejected like a piece of shit. Assholes are the ones that do the rejecting like a piece of shit.

Nope. You can be an enlightened tarzan, but still a tarzan. Plenty of shamans way more awake than Leo out there, yet barely above purple. Zen enlightened masters that believe women can't enlighten. And then there's my personal XP. Many many many many many many mystical experiences and awakenings yet still as blue as a pair of balls being squeezed by the rock. And the spiritual teachings I resonate with the most are extremely advanced, but very blue. Yet they are so advanced that the spiral doesn't even matter. Its a spec compared to infinity. And people actually change colour based on their environment. Chinese international students are blue in China, they come over to a democratic nation and start cheering to free the nipple... Love it, thats a nice way to put it.

2 personal insights today: 1) Always value the Truth/nonduality/God consciousness over materialism/3D matrix/ego consciousness. Do everything for God, not for the ego. 2) All of the wisdom, insight, love, honesty is in the present moment all the time. You don't need to chase it or go after it. Every atom in the universe has infinite love, wisdom and bliss. And all of your chasing is coming from wanting what's in that atom. You already have what you seek. All the time. 3) Be ruthless with thoughts. Don't give them any space to be believable. For example: bad pickup session generates negative thoughts about appearance, women's motives, fears about lack of income (inferiority complex), etc. For 1) you aren't picking up girls for pussy. You're doing it to get in touch with non duality and God consciousness more. Every rejection, embarresment, attack, bad perception that others have of you is an opportunity to drop thoughts, shed ego, and get closer to source. For 2) you already have everything that girl can give you every single second. For 3) The battle here is not believing thoughts. ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Further insights from 11/08/2020: 1) basically everything that causes suffering doesn't exist. It only seems to exist. Embarrassment, disappointment, annoyance, irritation, hatred, judgement, hopelessness, depression, are all surfaces. But they are not substance. You confuse those surfaces for substance, and that's the generation of suffering. Remember that the game has already been won. You've already completed the boss battle. You just haven't realised it till you penetrate the surface and enter the substance. You've already got everything that you ever wanted. Its the substance. 2) Your fear from doing great work (career) and picking up the hottest women (sexuality) comes from your fear of not being able to accept Truth. What if the truth is you're a shit guy? And that hurts your ego? What if pickup reinforces that? What if that hurts the ego? What if you can't accept that? The trick is, you can accept that, but you've been tricked into thinking you can't. THAT is where the suffering is coming from, from the fear that you can't accept the thing that causes the fear. Know that, you are capable of accepting everything. Regardless of what your thoughts or reality tries to tell you. Its in your nature, your blood, your DNA, to be capable of accepting every possible thing there is to accept. When going through fear in pickup or career about being rejected romantically or because of the work you do, know that if you penetrate through the thoughts, you CAN and WILL accept the way reality is by your nature. You don't need to fear about not being capable of accepting reality the way it is, because you CAN and WILL do that by default. Corollary to 2) if fear was real, you wouldn't be able to accept it. But you can accept it, precisely because its not real. You can accept the possibility of being raped, murdered, blown up by ISIS, going to jail, etc. Because the fear of those things are not real. You only think the fear is legitimate because you think its real. Literally the answer to being fearless is simply the realization that what the fear points to isn't real. Can't get any more direct than that. Its all about revealing the trick, opening the curtains on fear. Seeing what fear actually is, rather than what it seems/tells you it is. It is the ultimate trick of the entire universe. The heart/core of the devil. You were born to accept Truth. Its in your DNA to accept truth. Its not in your DNA to accept fear (or what the fear points to as a real thing). But that's the whole trick. Fear isn't real(or what fear points to isn't real), and the reason why you can accept everything, isn't because you are capable of accepting what the fear points to (you/God is not capable of accepting that) but you ARE capable of accepting the thing that is revealed once the fear has been seen as illusion. And that thing that reveals itself once fear is seen as an illusion, ALWAYS ultimately is revealed because its permanent and true. Fear is impermanent and so its temporary. Truth is eternal. Fear is limited while Truth (opposite to fear) is unlimited. For example, you fear being rejected when handing in your resume to an employee. Because you fear him revealing you as an imposter, bad worker, surfacing old traumas. The trick is, those things the fear points to, imposter, bad worker, surfacing of old traumas, aren't real. And what's real is the creator. So when you hand your resume to your employee, you're worried about all of those things becoming true (imposter, etc). But in reality, all that will come true is God. And to be fearless, is to realise that the things your fear points to are not real, and what's real is God. So when you hand in that resume, what will be revealed in actuality is God. But its so God damn hard to accept this. You're so scared of the alternative, that its hard to realise this. But that's the core of the devil. If you unlock this, you get everything you want. You're right in that you cannot accept being an imposter, bad worker, etc. You/God is incapable of accepting that. Its too bad to be true. So you're right to fear those things. But where you're wrong is those things aren't real, and the only thing that has to be accepted in this universe, is something you can accept as your birth right: which is Truth. The creator, the one that is revealed when you penetrate through the millions of layers of thoughts. EDIT Holy shit, all negative emotions stem from confusing truth for something that isn't true ?????? Holy shit my life was a lie. Again. How many times am I gonna realise my entire life was a lie, before I finally accept its a lie? Alright next goals: Go through the most challenging, difficult, hardest, things in life (and most rewarding) and fucken do it blissfully, fearlessly and lovingly. Put this insight to the maximus test. Bash ALL the fear out of you. 0 fear is the goal.

yep, Absolute hopelessness in trying. Yeah that's the right way to go about this. Its not the job, but your attitude that makes you happy, thanks.

So I've got massive dissatisfaction with my career at the moment. I feel completely uninterested in the work that I'm doing on a daily basis. Its reaching a critical level. I don't see the value of it, I don't feel like I'm progressing in the right direction. I don't feel like I'm getting anywhere. I don't feel inspired, fascinated, or excited with the work I'm doing. I'm always distracted by other things, stuff I'm more interested in. I don't have passion for my work, and a neglect of care for the outcome of my results. There is clearly something I'm more interested in, but I've kept away from it my entire life and tried to distract myself with other stuff because that thing is hard to make money off, and I've got autism and don't feel comfortable providing value through understanding people. I've also tried to apply Rupert Spira's wise words about his life purpose. He said he use to be a pottery maker. And he only transitioned to being a teacher because it helped more people, not because it made him happier. So a confusion I have is, I hate my job, does that mean I should really be trying to love the job I have, rather than changing? Is changing jobs an ego trick? On one hand I feel like Rupert is onto something, the path is about accepting what is. But on the other hand, I'm very very very drawn to other things. Its a powerful force that cannot be stopped. I'm deeply ineffective with my work because I don't like it. And I can't apply Rupert's words no matter how hard I try (been trying for past 3 yrs). I'm very very very clear on what I don't like, I've tried many things, through university courses and in the field. I don't like: Science, Technology, Engineering or mathematics (massive hate passion). Visual or musical art. western medicine and law. policing. firefighting. being a journalist. being a pilot. being a mechanic. being an athlete. being a tennis coach. magician What I haven't tried, but am quite sure I wouldn't like it: alternative healing personal development coach seduction coach using siddhis somehow to provide value (like siddhi vasi healing) alternative medicine nutritionist What I'm drawn to and interests me: 1. Eastern Philosophy. 2. How to live a good life. 3. Nonduality. Tantra. 4. Very big picture thinking. 5. some of the very big picture aspects of sociology. Not studying and science. I don't like science. I don't like making hypotheses, testing them, repeat. Rather I like applying eastern teachings and being directly aware of knowledge. What I truly want to do: 1. provide really valuable content that helps change people's perspectives to help them get through life with less stress, better health, more open mindedness politically/socially/scientifically/culturally. 2. Showing people, helping them experience the beauty in life. Helping them release tension, opening their minds up to timelessness, eternity, detachment, love, empowerment, etc. What are some videos or introductions to some people who are doing the above 2 points really passionately, and loving it?

Practically speaking, its better to rip the bandaid off quickly rather than slowly. As hard as it may seem, "if you're going through hell, keep going" ~ Winston Church hill. Clarity: Everything that's wrong with you right now is thoughts. Thoughts telling you something is wrong. Drop them. Its not that things are falling apart, its that your thoughts are telling you things are falling apart. Steps: Not sure what your spiritual/meditation style is. But if its Love, then look at the present moment and remind yourself that its all love. Remember a time when you felt love in the past, then make that feeling bigger and bigger, until it envelopes your entire awareness field. And at the same time, every thought telling you you're screwed somehow, let them go. Question them, go meta on them, etc. You're in a battle between truth and the devil. If you listen to your thoughts telling you you're going insane, the devil won. If you let go, then God will reveal himself as pure infinite love, and all of your problems will be solved.

pfft that's not insanity. You want real insanity? Take salvia or large doses of heavy psyches like DMT. It may give you a deeper appreciation for what real insanity is, so that when you have some standard mystical insights, you don't immediately palm them off as insanity. Real insanity is dissociation. Its taking such a large dose of psychedelics that you forget who you are, where you are, what the world is, what survival is, how to walk, who your parents are, whats are threats, etc.

What are the most effective forums and courses that specialise specifically in pickup. A forum where the average member has approached like 1000 girls. Is there any out there? Or equivelant courses.

Ayurveda and astrology are not purple. They are tools. Saying ayurveda is purple is like saying a hammer is purple. You guys use spiral dynamics way too much to describe things. When you've got a hammer, everything looks like a nail. When you're indoctrinated into spiral dynamics, everything has a colour. Including your penis apparently. Ayurveda, like all tools exist on all stages of the spiral. It exists in purple, but also in green with holistic medicines. Astrology exists in purple, but also exists in green with new age beliefs. @Artsu If you actually read spiral dynamics books, spiral dynamics has nothing to do with spirituality. Spiral dynamics is simply a model for describing how societies evolve. How people communicate and work together. it DOES NOT describe the inner workings of tools, or even people. If you use spiral dynamics to describe tools or to describe the psychology of a person, you're basically a clown, because that's got nothing to do with spiral dynamics. No human being is a colour. Only groups of people can be colours.

repression = tension, 'clinging', 'holding on'. If you let go, you release your repressed emotions. You're not letting go. You may think you are. But you're not. You're holding onto something. It seems like you're letting go. But you're not. Inquire and see why you're holding on. Let go. Embrace. Accept. Love. Focus on your 'blockage', then relax your muscles. Take very deep breaths. And on every out breath, chant to yourself "I Accept, Love, Embrace and Let go of this feeling". If you can't let go, and that frustrates you, then let go of the desire to let go. Keep doing this every single second of your walking life. Not 30 minutes a day, do it whenever it arises.

excellent!

2nd time posting in this journal within an hour. But its really just hit me what's going on here. Life goes on, houses, cars, work, employment, relationships, etc. But at the exact same time, none of that is actually happening. And we are all using houses, jobs, cars, employment, relationships to obtain what cannot be obtained... and that's ending the game. We are all trying to end the game through employment, love, relationships, etc. But to end the game means to go in the exact opposite direction of all those things and focus inward. We are like runners who confused the starting line for the finishing line. And we are running the wrong way. And the answer to all of our problems, the goal, the key to happiness, the way of getting everything we want, etc. Is to just simply end the game. We're like a dog chasing its tail, where the dualistic world is the dog, and WE, or I AM, or the remains of dropping everything, is the tail. Duality and non duality go in circles forever, and it does this at the exact same time, at every moment. It doesn't go through periodic cycles, it goes through no time, instantaneous cycles. The solution is NOW. Not after 100000s of hours of meditation, but NOW. The solution wasn't made by 100000s of hours of meditation, it was made simply by NOW.

whose head, if you're against being someone?

What I'm suggesting, really depends on you, not me. I could be suggesting, your question has nothing to do with getting enlightened faster, but rather, perpetuating the matrix. And therefore you should go meta on your question. Or I could be suggesting for you to continue with your question, but do it passionately, with excitement, curiosity, detachment, honesty and genuine intent. Rather than based off fear, inferiority, achieving goals or obtaining a particular state. Its really your call.