electroBeam

@Leo Gura Objections from 3 part series: 1. You've implicitly assumed throughout your videos that deconstruction, contemplation and trial & error definitively and absolutely leads to truth about what science is. What evidence, observations, reasoning, proof or experience verifies this assumption? And if you say blablabla verifies it, then what evidence, observations, reasoning, proof or experience verifies blablabla? If you say that you did not assume this, then how can you claim your critiques are valid? To expand more, you assumed that there are different methods that exists for discovering the truth. And the premise was you need to go around and try them all to find the truth. What evidence do you have to support that there are methods that discover the truth? How do you know for sure that a method caused a discovery of truth to occur. Can you verify that? It might sound far fetched, but what if you discovered truth without that method, and that method was a coincidence. And with that point begs the question on how do you know whether 1 method is more effective at discovering the truth then another method. What method are you using to rate the truth finding effectiveness of a particular method. And besides, the whole idea that methods are used to discover the truth is not entirely substantiated. There's no 100% evidence or observations that directly prove or even infer that. Spiritually talented people seem to get by without effective methods. 2. You said one of the problems of science is scientists specialising into technical fields of study, and what science needs more of is holism. What evidence do you have to support that an actual distinction between specialisation and holism even exists? The fabric of reality is consciousness whether that's limited to a specialised field of knowledge, or spread broadly throughout different domains. Contemplating what a wave is, yields the same result as contemplating what a solar system is, both the macro and micro are made of consciousness, so why is specialisation vs generalisation significant? And Leibniz did specialise in mathematics by the way, even though he had amateur understandings of other fields of study. 3. You said everyone has a different method of science throughout the world like language and religion. But that's not entirely true. If you look around at different cultures, there are coarse similarities between different cultures and developments of science. Many cultures independently made mathematics. If such a system is entirely relative, what explains such similarities. 4. You talked about the black hole effect. The black hole effect assumes that others aren't imaginary but real. If others are imaginary, then how could they ever understand what you(God) understands. Only God can understand, not god's imagination. And further, the problem is a lot worse then that, the problem isn't just limited to science, but also to mysticism. When you have an awakening experience, and someone else has an awakening experience, because you can't enter their minds, how do you know that their awakening experience = yours. If I said I discovered infinite love, and you said you discovered infinite love, how do you know that our experience and knowing = each other. How do you know its even possible for me to awaken to infinite love when from your POV I'm God's imagination and by default God's imagination cannot awaken to love because its not God. Also expanding on this point, you said science is tied in with language. How is this not also a problem in mysticism? How is the spiritual path also not directly tied with language? You might say that because mysticism is direct experience/knowing while language is conceptual, but once you break down that knowing to words you're creating false meaning. Isn't the entire spiritual path just breaking down knowing/being to false meaning? And if it is how can you even make any correlations what so ever between knowing/being and descriptions of it. Can you actually verify that the entire spiritual path isn't actually bullshit? And to add to the point above, you said that science talks a lot about experience, but no scientist knows what experience is. Isn't that also the case in mysticism? What is an awakening other than an experience, and if experience is meaning, then how is awakening also not meaning? Again you might say because you become directly conscious of it, but there is a black hole effect way worse then what you propose which is there is an impenetrable/absolute barrier between what one knows/be and what one describes.

just keep in mind there's no such actual thing as survival if you contemplate what survival is, you wont find an answer, perhaps because the concept of survival was actually a lie designed to wiggle your vibrational state, rather than explain some truth about what's happening.

@arlin do you not sleep? I'd like to study you more.

@seeking_brilliance luckily there's infinite amount of time to understand

enlightenment is relative. So you're both right

I agree but I have an intuition that I can understand God 100000% Understand God so much that I would be aware of everything about that dream character. It seems like a mystery, why is seeking_brilliance writing this, why is electroBeam writing this, but IDK I think that actually can be demystified. I have an intuition its possible, and that's why I'm super curious about and trying to do. Who knows maybe I'm full of shit... but it really doesn't feel that way. I think God can know him self to that level.

I'd rather try and help you wake up, rather than answer that question correctly. Yes I did use that 'technique' to have further awakenings... till I realised that I didn't even need that to have awakenings. That was just an unnecessary middle man. But also keep in mind that its not an experience, an experience is still dualistic. What that was, was an honest father son talk. Nothing flashy, but rather a lets stop playing around and get honest about what's actually happening here - minus all the awakening bullshit, insight bullshit, listening to teachers bullshit, even the meditation bullshit... because you were above all that all along, and that was all part of the separation. Part of the dance and play. Part of the story. The character of a play doesn't break the 4th wall by meditating. The character of the play breaks the 4th wall at the exact precise time it WANTS to stop playing, and wants to wake up. That's all awakening boils down to. But you're just God playing around, and God wakes up when it wants to. Everything else like meditating and yoga and all this BS is pretending to want to wake up as part of the story. But truly waking up comes from wanting it... or that's how it seems right before an awakening. I'm sure meditation and psychedelics may have a relative impact on how successful an actual awakening ends up being. IDK I just feel like what everyone on here is missing... is the WANT part. There is a lack of distinction between pretending to want, and to actually want. And those that just bullshit around here are pretending to want, while those who actually do wake up actually want to wake up. Maybe that helps? Not sure. Like You are imagining a hell of a lot more then what you think. You're even imagining the idea that waking up takes work... That's all a bullshit story. You're even imagining the idea that some people are spiritually talented while some aren't... that's totally bullshit because only You are here. You're even imagining up the idea that awakening is rare... that's totally bullshit because you're the only one here. Its not rare lol. You're making up the idea that its rare, that it takes hard work, that it takes spiritual talent to make waking up to yourself more fun. All of that is complete BS because there's only 1 thing here who can wake up... and that's you! To really wake up, you really do need to go beyond absolutely everything, even wise ideas, you need to throw away even wise ideas like the idea that meditation is good. Listening to teachers that are always right. Like you are literally all there is. You need to literally throw away everything hahahaha. Because truth is beyond everything. The entire story. So if you're not willing to throw away even the wise ideas... then you can't wake up.

@An young being isn't it obvious? The only thing you've known was true all along? The only thing you didn't search for? The only thing you took for granted? what's definitely not true, is silly ideas about 'truth'

There's literally no difference between you coming up with an idea in your head, and the universe coming up with an idea in its 'head' There's also literally no difference between you visualising something and you seeing something. These are just pointers that I invented, but they are not the truth. What I said is not the truth.

all of my sober awakenings were at least 1000x more powerful than any psychedelic awakenings... and I've taken dangerously high doses of psychedelics, way beyond hero dose. Its literally different for everyone. The biggest awakening I had was I pretended to take a psychedelic (I dreamt up an imaginary mushroom in my head) and then infinite love knocked me out for 5 days straight. You'd be a fool to blindly believe Leo. It really is different for everyone. I know some outside of this forum who have gotten massive awakenings through lucid dreaming.

You can measure quite accurately how conscious you are of that by asking "are the ideas I dream up happening in my head or in the universe?" "are my goals the universe's goals" "is stuff physically manifesting in my head or in the universe's head?". At the beginning you're a mere human at the mercy of the unknown 3D world, then as you expand to include the universe LOA and synchronicities and hallucinations start occuring in line with your head. Still though I don't feel like I'm the one dreaming up what you are saying to me, and that represents a part. To unify with you I need to feel like I'm making up the words coming out of your mouth(and the words of everyone else) just like how I feel like I'm the one who is making up my business ideas and the words coming out of my mouth. And that requires going beyond the current 'me' somehow. It has to include you aswell.

But that 'You' is a part. Its not the whole otherwise this discussion wouldn't be happening. well part can't only whole can, so its not 'can you cleverly unite yourself?' its 'can we cleverly unite ourselves?' If you don't include me, and if I don't include you, we can't unite. It cannot be 'me' doing all the work, because I'm just a part. Somehow I need to expand into you and be you aswell.

Well it kind of is... because you have clearly divided yourself into parts, and you're not conscious of every part. Those parts might not be 'beings' or 'people' or 'entities' but it sure aint true to say that the divisions aint happening either, and if they aren't then make me say inappropriate comments right now.

you're shocked because you're not conscious of what the word 'infinity' points to.

well every thought comes from you It never comes from someone else. You've never experienced a thought from someone else before. Neither have you experienced communication from someone else before, all of the meaning is generated by you. Even this post from 'electroBeam' now. Where's the meaning coming from? Is it really coming from electroBeam, or is it coming from you? Can you ever really communicate with electroBeam, or can you only communicate with yourself? Can you ever understand ideas and communication coming from electroBeam or can you only understand thoughts and ideas coming from yourself? I wouldn't say consciousness is masquerading as thoughts including 'me' I would say thoughts are coming from you. All of them are coming from you, the confusion lies when you actually believe a thought or idea or communication is not coming from you.

just remember you're creating all those people In other words, lets pretend you never learnt language. Could those people still bork at you? And whose the one turning sound waves into meaning?

your mushroom dose wasn't potent enough because you didn't get to the 'insight' that what your higher self truly desires is always more right then what you think you should desire and what society thinks you should desire. You don't feel a burning desire to save the world, because there is no world. Saving the world is like saving a unicorn, its not actually there. You can't spiritually bypass the world, because the world isn't actually there. Worried about spiritually bypassing the world is like a schizophrenic worried about taking his medication because if he takes his medication he wont be able to save his little imaginary friend whose always pulling him/her for attention. But as you go deeper, there will be a desire to express compassion to yourself(yourself being 'the world'). And that compassion wont be wrapped up in ideologies about what you should and shouldn't be doing, or what you're doing it to (the world or whatever) it will be as natural as taking a shit. Just expressing it because there's too much compassion within you and you need to ejaculate it out for your own sanity.

Usually you're aiming for something on the path, so aiming for some experience or result. To aim for something you need to make assumptions about what you're aiming for. And with those assumptions comes a lot of belief baggage. After having an insight or awakening or whatever, you realize all of those assumptions are wrong. Its natural to feel amazing and just awesome moments during and after the awakening, but its also just as natural to feel angry or agitated or depressed or upset about how all the effort you put in, and changes you made to your perspective of life, has now gone to waste because you will never get what you're aiming for because it was never there in the first place(as it was just an assumption). There's really no way I've found to overcome that, you just need to get pissed off and ride through it. But if you find something that works let me know. And also ego backlashes aren't bad, they are just experiences to ride through, it even makes life fun. Would be boring if life was happy happy happy all the time.

Wait you need to be smart to get results in this work? Fuck that's scary...

I'm just posting this genuinely out of curiosity. If its not high quality enough, feel free to lock it and let me know. Recently my perception has changed a little. Its been happening for more then a month now, and it gets stronger by the day. The main thing is... everyone's face is starting to look super alien like. Its like I'm in an alien society and looking at all these aliens. The facial features of each human gives me a strong sense of abstraction, unfamiliarity, deep intelligence that I'm unaware of. Also each person is giving me a strong strong strong sense that they work in ways that is deeply mysterious. Its like I don't know how this person thinks at all. There's no ultimate logic, pattern, system or script that this person is working off, they are working off pure mystery. I'm not using mystery as a scapegoat for lack of understanding them, what I mean is, the most advanced, enlightened alien lifeform could not demystify how a human being works, and how they think. They can make estimates and predictions but not know fully. And this just adds to the feel that I'm in some sort of alien society. This feeling is not mild. Its deeply strong, it is indistinguishable from the scenario that I was abducted by humans and put on earth from some other planet. I know that you can link this to nonduality and spirituality, but its not really spirituality, its more related to paranormal psychology. This is a paranormal aspect happening within me, consciousness work is a superset or beyond what I'm talking about here. I'm wondering if there are resources, links, or others that feel a very very very strong sense that humans are aliens, just because I'm super curious about it. I'm not really looking for crazy beliefs, I want stuff that is directly grounded in empirical evidence and experience and knowing.

Top values is relative construct. What you want... is what I want... which is what leo wants... which is what Trump wants... which is what your mum wants... which is what your friends want... which is what a bird wants... which is what a single cellular organism wants. What we all want(including you) is not an object, noun, thing, concept, layer of abstraction, liberation or freedom or all those silly spiritual concepts. What we all want can only be felt. But not spoken about or known or understood or dissected or broken down or reduced. But we all aren't wise enough to see that, so we break it down into lots of money, love, food... and even "truth". And saying "I'll probably change it later" is falling for that exact mistake. When Leo says you'll never discover truth unless its your top value, if he's speaking from wisdom(which maybe he's speaking from delusion IDK) what he's actually saying is you'll never get what you want unless you want the think that can only be felt but not labelled a word or concept...

@Leo Gura why should we believe you imaginary man?

The answers on here are weird as fuck, very indirect. I personally experience ego backlashes every week (so 1 week will be very very high levels of consciousness, godhead, etc and then the next week ill be extremely agitated like I've got a mental disorder). Its been like that for the past 3 to 4 years. If you're better then that, you're all good. You dont need to motivate yourself, the ego backlash will pass and you'll naturally go back to inquiry.

There's a teaching which says that no others exist. No others exist... yet isn't it a delight to talk to someone? No others exist... yet don't you feel love for them? No others exist... yet you sure want to help them. And if no others exist, it sort of implies that you have the monopoly on reality... because you know I AM GOD. So therefore I am the truth and everyone else is false. All those people are false while I am true. I must know more than them because I am God... But that doesn't really feel right does it? And is that really the perspective you want to adopt anyway? Its sort disconnecting, a lack of heart towards other beings. And besides if you have a monopoly on reality, because you're god, the only thing that exists, why can't you control the dream? If you truly do have a monopoly on truth, if you really are God, then go turn me into a lizard now Go make Trump disappear. Etc. But if you look closely, you can't really find evidence that these other beings don't exist. Rather what you *might* find, is each person might actually exist... but exist as a silhouette of a division of consciousness... as if the present moment is a broken glass panel. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Broken_glass.jpg And each person is a representation of a division. You can look at all of us, your mum, dad... are they really not existing? Or are they existing as just a segment or division of the present moment? And when the representation dies, maybe they just come back to you. Like they are a rubber band stretched out from that fragment aspect of yourself, and death is just cutting the band so they fling back to you. Is it really that bad if a loved one dies? Maybe you can actually feel more love for them when they do die because they merge with you lol. I don't know, I'm probably full of shit... but this perspective is definitely much nicer, because it gives you the freedom to know why you can't control the dream(because everyone, all of those segments of consciousness all take part in controlling the dream, not just the segment you're inhabiting), and why you feel love for others when apparently they don't exist. And why its possible to still learn from others even though they are you, and why its still ok to communicate with others. And it gives you a better understanding of the significance of getting along with others... maybe we are all just segments of consciousness communicating to each other. And it gives(not a lot tbh) a tiny bit of clarity of what happens when the mind and body dies... flinging back from wherever you are, right into the heart of that segment. Instead of I am god, maybe its we are god. And instead of it being I am the creator... maybe its we are the creator. If you really are the creator, then turn me into a lizard... of course you can't because all of the segments of the present moment are all taking a small part in the creation process... If you want to be the creator... as in you instead of us... then you need to communicate with all those segments and get them all synchronised so that we all create in synchrony... which is a pipe dream but nice to dream.

@zeroISinfinity ahh ok interesting. I don't feel like saying this shit when remembering, i only feel like saying it when I don't remember