robdl

Forgot to address this. You’re speaking of technical or practical knowledge. How to drive, knowing where to go, and so on. But knowledge can be much more pervasive than that when knowledge gets intertwined with self/identity (I’m a Buddhist, I’m smart/knowledgeable, I’m a nurse, etc.); when knowledge is intertwined with belief(as belief is a movement of seeking security); and when knowledge (or experience) is an attachment to memory/the past. This is the psychological knowledge faceless and I are speaking of. It’s the movement of knowledge that is also the movement of identity(self), fear/insecurity/belief, and time/attachment to the past. And so the movement of thought-self-psychological time sustaining its own movement. (3 dualistic terms for the same unitary movement).

Same!

I did - hehe. Attack on knowledge is attack on ego/thought-self because attachment/identification to this knowledge is one and the same movement of thought-self/ego.

known perpetuates knower perpetuates known.

Anna I’m just indicating potential thought traps to be avoided. Some may resonate and some may not. Hope that’s cool. if they don’t resonate with you, maybe it’ll catch someone else’s attention as well. I’m speaking to everyone.

One trap of the ego/thought-self is to cross-compare two people sharing information, conceptually note that they are consistent with one another, and store it as knowledge/memory. This can be just the movement of the intellect/thought-self, self-perpetuating. When knowledge/memory is asserted, the past (time) is asserted. Time and thought-self are one and the same movement.

I was noting the movement of knowledge-time in action. The tendency has to be paid attention to, to understand how thought-self seeks security in authority, concept, knowledge.

There are no authorities, second-hand teachings, or memories/knowledge when it comes to the self-understanding, the insight we’re talking about. This is thought-self asserting time/knowledge, which is the same thing as saying thought-self asserting thought-self. Seeking security in its own movement.

The unitary movement is astonishing. The apparent dualistic language we use to describe this unitary movement in words is astonishing too - haha. 50 ways to express something that’s one and the same.

Thought attaching to thought breeds I-thought. Saying fear breeds fear, or desire breeds desire, or even fear breeds desire, is also saying the same thing. Self-fear-desire all movement of thought, seeking security in its own movement.

I told you you were walking with me

One can’t be speaking from memory, knowledge, belief (all the past).

Has this been seen directly, wholly - in clear fact, or has thought-self identified itself with/clung onto the knowledge/concept to perpetuate itself?

One needs to see that the movements of fear and desire in thought in daily life are movements of escaping and seeking. But escaping and seeking are one and the same. Fear and desire are one and the same. This must be seen. Fears of loneliness/desires of companionship, fears of failure/desires for success, fears of poverty/ desires for wealth. All thought-self seeking security in its own movement.

You don’t know it yet but you’re walking with me right now. You’ll see it. And you will laugh cosmically.

Thought-self introducing time, is thought-self in the movement of seeking its own security. It’s a movement of fear. Because time (psychological time, not clock time) is/of thought. Thoughts of past/thought projections of future (future-thoughts bred from past thought-self.) The subtletly of this trap is astonishing. But you will see it.

No to-do’s no-how-to’s No escapes No seeking passive attention that is whole/silent.

“How to’s?” fuel the fire of thought-self and sustain its movement.

Here’s a practical example everyone on the forum can relate to. You read a spiritual book or watch a YouTube video that says that thought needs to end for enlightenment to happen. Thought then hears this and almost compulsively creates a “how to end thought?” thought. Which then breeds thought-self seeking for methods, answers — this is self-perpetuation of thought-self in action.

The issue is that this can become a debate/argument which is actually thought-self engaging in an ego defensive mode to sustain its movement/seek security in its beliefs

See my edits

Thought (self) is akin to a self-feeding or self-perpetuating movement/loop that is fueled by volition, desire, fear, belief, knowledge, ideas, etc. Giving thought-self methods, beliefs, goals, etc., feeds this loop. But this is hard to understand from within this movement of self-seeking. It has to be seen wholly, not coming from a conditioned point of view. Thought-self is always seeking security in its own movement. Movements of seeking/escape fuel it. Thought-self then creates a “how to end thought-self?” (I.e, seeking/escaping) which is thought-self perpetuating itself. See the subtletly of these traps? It’s incredible, actually.

Caution about this: Thought-self takes the direction “drop them” and thought in the form of doer-ship, volition, self, time, effort (all apparent variants of thought-self but all one and the same movement) gets perpetuated. Thought uses even notions of killing thought to perpetuate thought. Self-feeding loop. There first needs to be self-understanding of this mechanistic nature of thought that is seeking security in its own movement, otherwise notions of dropping thought will be used by thought to serve thought’s purpose. One if not the biggest mind-fuck.

Problems - movement from what-is. Desire - movement from what-is. Fear - movement from what-is. Psychological time - movement from what-is. The nature of thought itself is movement from what-is. And see the involvement of desire/wanting, fear/worry, and time (dwelling on past/considering the future) in our problems? All one and same movement of thought.

Nah. This tendency is universal. I've done it.