traveler

I have been wondering a bit about the mind-body's self development and growth after the realizing of the true self. I have noticed that my personal drive and motivation has gone down quite a bit, as the interest doesn't lie in the personal identity that much anymore. This has made me pretty careless when it comes to changing my bad habits. I find myself eating bad food, going to sleep late and all the other stuff you do when your in that kind of cycle. The personal drive to change this is close to gone though, and I'm unsure if this is just my mind using the insight I have gotten as an excuse to indulge in unhealthy activities. I believe that caring for your body while being in human form is very important, relatively. But it seems like my suffering before was one of the biggest motivators to change my habits, and now looking from the perspective of one who doesn't experience much suffering, it's hard to do the things I know is "best" for the body. Thoughts?

You can not stop the mind, using the mind. When the mind is overwhelmed, it is always talking about you in correlation to the situation. Then the natural instinct is to resist the feeling that comes with the situation, which as you said only creates more suffering. You can not DO nothing and the acceptance has to be deeper that the mind trying to get rid of the feelings. In situations where your mind is overwhelmed it is because all of your attention is on it. You are fuelling the mind by giving it so much attention. But don't think too much about this when it's happening, because then you'll just be frustrated that you can't get your attention of your mind haha. Although in my experience it helps to realize that your attention is on the mind at that moment. This creates a small distance. Then realize that the mind is just rambling about all sort of shit, and that you believe everything that it is saying. See that the mind is occuring in you and therefore can't be you. This creates a bigger distance between you and your mind, if it clicks, and will therefore instantly ease up your emotional state. This requires a lot of awareness though, and can be very frustrating when it doesn't "click." But observe the frustration too.

I had the exact same thoughts and concerns as you have, before I had a really profound and authentic awakening experience. For the ego the idea that everything is one can be very grim or very beautiful, depending on how you look at it. But it can never be grasped by the thinking mind. A lot of what Leo says in his video is the same information I received through my own experience. You the ego who has these mind based ideas and fears about enlightenment is not the one who wakes up. The character in the dream can't wake up, as he is a part of it. The absolute beauty of life, can not be appreciated through unawakened eyes. I'm not saying that I'm enlightened or an awakened being. I'm not. The ego is very much still there. You don't see it and then spend the rest of your life blissed out. A lot of integration has to be done after, in almost every case, I believe. But when the seeing goes deep enough, you can not unsee it or forget it. The interpretations of what you saw will always be wrong to an extend though, when taking over by the mind.

I knew yesterday that it was finally my time. I was gonna smoke some weed alone, which I have never done before, and surrender completely. I went outside and sat on a bench and smoked my joint, my ego had a lot of bubbling and I laid down on the bench. My heart began pounding faster than it had ever pounded and I completely surrendered to the fact that I was going to die. I stopped holding on to anything, and the world that I thought I new crystallized into complete nothingness and everything was at the same time. I saw everything as it was and spent eternity in this place. Then suddenly I was back laying on this bench outside. I got up and went home, knowing that none of this is real. You wake up to the fact that all of this is just a play of consciousness. There is no control and no one controlliling, only experiencing. Everything is intimately interconnected, everything is pure experience, there is nothing to worry about and no one left to worry. Everything is appearing on the screen of consciousness. It is the eternal play of infinite possibilities. It is freedom.

I'm right there with you my friend. I also had a very strong LSD trip, and some LSD flashbacks on weed. I've also had awakening experiences while meditating. I have a hard time observing my thoughts and emotions without attaching or interfering, and they have gotten pretty strong lately. I think it's my ego that has taken the knowledge that i've learned from spiritual teachers on youtube and is using the methods given by them to hide within. It's really hard noticing when this happens, as it from the perceived point of view seems like I'm observing without attaching, but one good rule is to remember that if you're not in a light, joyful or peaceful state then you are not perceiving from the state of the self. The harder I try to observe and meditate the worse it gets, when I'm in a deep meditation suddenly something within me says "stop," and then it seems like I'm transforming into another dimension where there is complete stillness without mind. There is really nothing "you" can do to wake up.

So I'm done reading "A new earth" by Eckhart Tolle, and I really can't understand this part: THE FREQUENCY-HOLDERS The outward movement into form does not express itself with equal intensity in all people. Some feel a strong urge to build, create, become involved, achieve, make an impact upon the world. If they are unconscious their ego will, of course, take over and use the energy of the outgoing cycle for its own purposes. This, however, also greatly reduces the flow of creative energy available to them and increasingly they need to rely on “efforting” to get what they want. If they are conscious, those people in whom the outward movement is strong will be highly creative. Others, after the natural expansion that comes with growing up has run its course, lead an outwardly unremarkable, seemingly more passive and relatively uneventful existence. They are more inward looking by nature, and for them the outward movement into form is minimal. They would rather return home than go out. They have no desire to get strongly involved in or change the world. If they have any ambitions, they usually don’t go beyond finding something to do that gives them a degree of independence. Some of them find it hard to fit into this world. Some are lucky enough to find a protective niche where they can lead a relatively sheltered life, a job that provides them with a regular income or a small business of their own. Some may feel drawn toward living in a spiritual community or monastery. Others may become dropouts and live on the margins of society they feel they have little in common with. Some turn to drugs because they find living in this world too painful. Others eventually become healers or spiritual teachers, that is to say, teachers of Being. I don't get this part at all. Why would you turn to drugs after awakening? Why would this world be too painful to live in, after awakening to the truth? The way every spiritual teachers refers to the truth, is the peace and bliss that comes with it. Why would the world be too painful to live in, if you awaken to the truth of all there is. How can the Enlightenment, which is supposed to be "the end of suffering" in Buddhas words, lead to this.

Thank you for this

Enlightenment isn't really that easy to attain, as there are many years of egoic conditioning deep inside us all. I think a lot of people would have done it if it was that easy. I've had enlightening experiences, and these questions would probably seem very insignificant from an enlightened perspective. But there's no where else to go, we won't go anywhere after enlightenment, so It's a pretty valid question in my opinion. Why would you turn to drugs after enlightenment? Can you answer that question?

" Others may become dropouts and live on the margins of society they feel they have little in common with. Some turn to drugs because they find living in this world too painful. Others eventually become healers or spiritual teachers, that is to say, teachers of Being. " Why would he talk about others becoming spiritual teachers in the sentence right after the people turning to drugs sentence? Try reading the whole bit again, doesn't it seem a bit confusing to you? He also talks about someone being drawn to spiritual communities and monestary's.

These are the frequency holders, supposedly enlightened people holding the frequency of the earth on a high level. If you're enlightened, and you're more inward looking by nature, then it seems like you are not fit at all for this world. But what I don't get is how you can be enlightened and still suffering?

I haven't really felt that good either after my awakening experience. It's beautiful in the moment of realising, but as soon as the ego takes over again, it's like you're an alien in this world. You know that you are everything and that everything happening in it's essence is nothing, but this realisation is pretty depressing for the ego. What I don't understand is the fact that the chapter is called "Frequency holders," but how can your frequency be high if your taking drugs to supress the pain of this world? I don't get it.

I've made a post about this topic before, but It's pretty important to me and I would like to hear some other perspectives. I'm getting a double jaw surgery in the next year or two, and I'm having trouble with the fact that it isn't really possible to be unconscious. Anesthesiologists don't know what it is that makes patients unconscious, unknowing of the fact that it is impossible to ever lose consciousness. As Sadhguru says in the article below, the Anesthesia only numbs the recalling process. I have had many enlightening experiences; a huge shift in consciousness, I'm living as the separate self, but I'm aware that this is an illusion). The thing about this that troubles me a bit is the fact that I'm now aware that the anesthesia doesn't really make you unconscious and the possibility that the "level" of consciousness therefore has an influence on how you're gonna react to the anesthesia. Sadhguru doesn't really answer this question, he kind of dances around it, as he does a lot . The reason for my worrying is the continouisly expanding awareness I'm experiencing. I'm aware every morning that I'm asleep and that I am dreaming, so if I'm aware while sleeping why should I not be aware while doctors break up my jaws? As you could imagine this is pretty concerning. I try not to worry too much though, as It is in the future, and not now. I would LOVE and really APPRECIATE if you guys could tell me about your experiences, especially If you underwent surgery with total awareness of the separate self and your true self. THANK YOU! https://isha.sadhguru.org/in/en/wisdom/article/anesthesia-and-consciousness

Thank you guys for your answers. It definitely helps hearing these things from you!

Suffering because other people are suffering, leads to even more suffering. To end suffering you have to stop feeding into the story of the suffering self of you and others. Because it is the story itself, that is the cause of the suffering in the first place.

This is a 4 part documentary that I watched today, I thought it was amazing.

So what you're saying is that we're already perfect, but at the same time we are working towards perfection? Please, correct me if I'm interpreting you answer wrong. I don't see how you could be a work towards perfection, when everything already is perfect as it is.

Can you elaborate, please?

How can actions flow against perfection? If everything is perfect, and it is, then there is no "wrong" or "right" actions. You can do horrible things and it won't go against perfection, doing horrible things won't glitch reality or make it not perfect. Control is an illusion. Everything we do is in alignment with the divine. We as human beings are a manifestation of infinity. We are not separated from it, we are it, and therefore control is an illusion. No actions can separate you from what you truly are.

What are your thoughts on the simulation theory? If we look from an enlightened perspective, it still holds up from what I can see. We are consciousness/the universe manifesting itself into infinite possibilities. This is all there is and all there will ever be. But in theory this 'all there is', could be inside "something". Like a computer game where there are individual characters, these characters could wake up to the fact that they are no different from anything else in the game and therefore they themselves are everything, a manifestation of code. The universe/consciousness could be a self developing simulation that creates infinite possibilities and dimensions within itself, when we wake up to understand that we are no more or no less than a manifestation of that, we lose the illusion of individuality and become one with the source. In the computer game metaphor this would mean that the character in the game realises that he is everything, but what isn't realized and what is impossible to ever realize is that the source (the code) is a creation from a computer game developer from a universe separate from his. I know there's kind of a hole in this because the computer game is in itself a manifestation of consciousness infinite possibilities, but it's hard conveying it in any other way. Couldn't the source, the absolute consciousness be a creation in theory? While I read through this the answer becomes clear. It isn't possible for consciousness to be a separate thing, because everything that appear separate, such as a creator of consciousness would be itself consciousness. I started and ended a topic before posting it, but this is something I had thought about a couple of times and it now is clear after reading my own words. So a thing you could take from this post is that sometimes it helps to write about a thing that you can't seem to wrap you head around, because underway you'll notice some "plotholes" that you didn't notice in your mind. I would still love other perspectives

So this is the area of thought where my ego keeps its hold of me. I've woken up to the truth about a week ago, and went straight into a spiritual void (Dark night of the soul, kind of thing). I'm 19 years old and my parents are on vacation. Therefore I've been home alone with my sister this whole week. After I woke up (because of a LSD flashback when I smoked weed), my ego totally shattered. I could see everything, and it didn't go away the following days. I realized that I was a lot more compassionate towards my sister and my friends. It was like every thought that held a barrier between us before was removed, and I could feel a sense of connection I didn't have before. But most of the time it was dark. I felt really alone, knowing that I was a part of everything, but seeing that everyone was trapped in their mind, that constantly plays with their energy/emotions. My sister began to notice my changes more and more as the days went by. I tried to tell her that I wasn't the same anymore, that my ego had shattered into pieces and that I saw things other people didn't see. But she didn't get it. Of course she didn't, why would she. I also tried to tell my friends this, but it seems that everyone has a reaction of fear when I talk about these things, as if I'm threatening their ego. Okay, so back to my question. I feel that I'm stuck. I am a really empathic guy, I feel everything. Because of that I know, from my experiences with my family, especially my mom, that a really big part of their identity relies on me as a son and a brother. Playing the role that I have always played. The big change in me made my sister cry because she was worried. She said it's like I'm not even me. My biggest worry is my parents though, especially my mom. I know that they both feel incomplete. My mom relies on vacations, weekends and her children (me and my sister) for happiness. My dad is lost in the constant search of hidden agendas as in conspiracy theories and is agitated about his life situation. I don't know how they are gonna be happy without me and my sister living at home. It's hard for me to see this deep incompleteness in everyone around me. Okay, so finally my question: How do you deal with family and friends (especially family) feeling like they are loosing you after enlightenment? This is the hardest question for me. Some people would probably say "you are not responsible for other people," or "you are a part of the divine, therefore everything and everyone is your family," but this is the biggest and hardest illusion for the ego to let go, isn't it? The illusion that you have a group of people that you identify yourself with, as a part of your blood. If I let them go what do I do then? You still have to participate in the illusion to live in this world, but how do you do that when every problem or entertainment is for the lower consciousness? And how do you give up the illusion as a son, brother and friend? I know this is a very long and unstructured post with a lot of questions. I hope some of you have some useful perceptions of this. Thank you!

I'm having a huge surgery in the future. Double jaw surgery. I'm gonna be under general anesthesia, and I'm interested if some of you have been through this as awakened beings. First of all I would like to know if it went smoothly, without problems. I interested this because I've been worried about anesthesia awareness, and if there is a higher risk if you are on a higher consciousness than most people? Also I'm interested in knowing what effect the anesthesia has had on your consciousness. It's a little unsettling that anesthesiologists doesn't really know how it works. This is because it works on the level of the understanding of consciousness. But doesn't this imply that your level of consciousness has a say in how much and how well it will work? And how is it that a drug is able to send you into total nothingness for hours and then turn you back after? I actually think this is a very interesting topic.

That is good to know, thanks! Where you in a non-dualistic state of mind in the period you underwent surgery, and do you think this can have an effect? This might be a dumb question, but I'm interested.

yeah you are right with observing the ego. I have to get better at that. Thank you. My appetite was lost because of the feeling of the void I think. The sudden change from everything feeling familiar to really unfamiliar. I feel like I have to participate in non mindfull things in order to gain appetite, so today I've tried to do a lot of things that is "bad" (bad food, nikotin, etc.) for me, to gain my appetite and the feeling of familiarity back. But as I do this, I feel deep inside that it's not the right thing to do. I like the familiarity, but my old self belongs there, and I can feel it in the silence between youtube video or other things I occupy my mind with, that I'm not content when I'm trying to forget about my true nature. I'm not able to go back to the old me as I was, as I know deep down it would cause more suffering than good.

Thank you for replying! Yes the ego sure has a lot of ways to scare you away from this path. It's lovely to have a community where you can learn from other peoples insight. I already feel better knowing someone else has been through this. Another thing that I don't know if my ego does or if it's just the shift in consciousness, is that it seems like I'm not able to get totally involved in a movie anymore. The loss of identity seems to make it harder for me to relate to what is happening on the screen. This is not a gigantic loss, but it was still a thing I really enjoyed before, getting lost in another world on the screen. What are your thoughts on this? Is it possible that it is my ego who is tricking me into thinking that I won't ever be able to enjoy a good movie again, unless I lower my consciousness? Also, last question, did you also have a huge loss of appetite when you went through this? When I'm in a higher state of consciousness, it seems that I'm never hungry.