tsuki

I am having a hard time understanding what is your point here? How are these two things at odds? Because a man can make you go crazy before you are in a relationship with him. The driver of this craziness is prior to conscious choice and I'm interested in it. These two things are not necessarily at odds, they are unrelated, orthogonal. Since you have the experience of "craziness", you can describe it from your "end".

The fact that attraction is prior to deliberation does not mean that it can't be understood and expressed openly. Every single thing that we do has a purpose.

@Etherial Cat I find it interesting that on one hand you agreed that there are male behaviors that make (or made) you go crazy and on the other hand you are saying that a good relationship is adventurous enough. I don't think that you're being honest here and I wonder why. Is it because your man does not do this for you and you want to protect your conscious decision to be with him from your unconscious judgement based in survival? I can relate to this sentiment from the other end of sex/gender. It is very destructive for me to judge myself for not "scoring" hundreds of women even if I consciously recognize that it is not an optimal way of getting what I really want. I will not deny the existence of this impulse though and can describe what drives it when asked. I was thinking that you, as a conscious women that I consider you to be, can describe yours. What I got instead is the answer why intimate relationships are okay, which I'm not denying as I'm in one myself.

@Leo Gura I've been interested in this for some time and I was not able to crack it. I was thinking that since day traders actually make money, then it must mean that they add value to the world and I was wondering what that value was. Now I am open to the possibility that it is my capitalist ideology screwing my thinking up and that I had this backwards. Is value strictly subjective and nothing more than a need based on survival? But then, the highest value would be transcending survival altogether, which is so ahead of the curve that practically nobody even considers it as something to aspire to. So creating a business and providing value is strictly relative to what people consider to be desirable and is about feeding them the things that they want? That sounds very misaligned with the idea of life purpose. If I want to create something and I know that it's my highest calling, then that is relative to me and fulfilling my own needs. Obviously, I can't just create stuff for its own sake because I need food, so that thing has to be valued by others. Not only that, but valued for what it really is, not marketed as something else that they want because that would be very unsatisfying for the creator. I guess that there is no silver bullet in bridging high and low consciousness. That sounds like a good life purpose for a coach out there :).

I heard that statement in relation to the "average person" that is not informed about cryptocurrencies. Why is that? Is it about the rise of the bubble where people that can't assess the value suddenly become interested in it?

Take conscious ownership of your survival needs. This helps to both alleviate your attachment and deepens your relationship by letting the other person speak of her needs freely.

Awesome thread, learned a TON by reading it! @Leo Gura @Etherial Cat @Preety_India Since you seem to agree that this is the case, why do you think edgy behavior (as Leo defined it) makes women tick? Does this project the promise of adventure, or is it maybe about safety? _______ Or, to put it in a different way: what kind of person did you @Leo Gura become when you learned this skill? And: what kind of women are you @Etherial Cat and @Preety_India when you encounter such a man? I mean, describe the experience. What is it about?

You keep using this symbol "∵" or "∴" in your writing. What do they mean? ______________ If meditation freaks you out so much, why are you drawn to it? I mean, there are all sorts of techniques and not all are about not-doing anything. For example, there are mindfulness techniques that have you recognize (label) various aspects of your experience that fill your awareness spontaneously. This could be beneficial for you because your imagination seems to be very active and you're having trouble distinguishing what you think from what is actually happening. Are you getting this? These are your thoughts about possible scenarios, not things actually happening. When you are scared, it's difficult to see the difference and mindfulness meditation can help you keep that understanding. Other techniques develop focus so that your attention can rest on an object effortlessly and these thoughts won't arise spontaneously. There are also meditations that develop equanimity, which will let you actually be okay with having these thoughts. Give me another example, another story. These thoughts may come to remind you of something important that you have repressed, or forgotten. To experience them is to get to the bottom of it, to understand, for yourself, why you are having them. When you do, you will have a different relationship to them.

@levani Did I get this right? Are you in constant activity because you are afraid of slowing down and experiencing these scary thoughts? Tell me these scary thoughts. Just let them out for me please. Do you have any history of "freaking out" without meditation/psychedelics? These thoughts are not to be removed, but experienced in a safe environment. Therapy is not a surgery that will cut your tumor out. It is alright to have all kinds of thoughts, even the scary ones and it does not imply anything about you as a person.

@Endangered-EGO Not sure how to help you other than point towards Shinzen Young's videos about the topic. He says that developing equanimity is sometimes the only way to deal with pain for people that can't alleviate it. In my experience, suffering is distinct from the sensations that cause it. When I stub my toe and focus directly on the sensation in my foot, I usually don't suffer in the sense that there is no need for screaming. In my experience, thoughts about the sensations arise precisely to distract me away from the experience because it is judged by the mind to be too intense. Being entangled with the narrative instead of focusing on the sensation is suffering itself. It is especially apparent when anticipation of future events arises, or thoughts about inevitability of it. It is easy to get overwhelmed by thoughts, but they are mostly fabricated to cover up the fact that the mind does not know much of the stuff that it thinks about. It is especially apparent when attempts to control circumstances are ineffective and sometimes lead to tantrums. The mind is simply a child that can't help himself to do these things. Suffering as described above is also called a regression, which is pretty accurate when consider how infants express their irritation. The closest that comes to everyday pain like in your case it is my back and neck problems. When I'm not having an inner tantrum in response to it, I am able to actually take responsibility and act to alleviate it. But that does not come from thinking, but rather being able to stay present with the sensation so that genuine understanding can arise. When immersed in thought-cloud, it is not always obvious what the problem really is, so zeroing-in to it may take some time. Thankfully I don't get lost that often anymore. Again, not sure if this post is helpful as I'm mostly talking about myself here. Have a good day and good luck with your practices.

@levani What is your relationship with spiritual practices? Why do these thoughts come up in relation to them? Also, are you comfortable being alone when you are not thinking about spirituality, psychedelics, etc? Have you tried psychedelics before? What do you believe about psychedelics and meditation to be true without prior experience of it?

It sounds like something you would go for after mastering equanimity. I mean, when you feel that equanimity is important and you are focused on being equanimous in the presence of all stimuli, then this importance is a big attachment. I would say that letting go of that attachment is meta-equanimity. Let's not fall into the pre/post fallacy here and equate that with not learning equanimity at all. Meta-equanimity is only helpful if your attachment to equanimity is your biggest source of suffering.

And yet, you want to be free . What's up with that? Maybe you want to be free from your overly-active sex drive?

Freedom and relationships are not mutually exclusive. On one end, there is a possibility of an open relationship. On the other end, when you are truly close to your partner, then you feel free to be yourself. I suggest going deeper with your conversations, communicating your needs clearly, and it will help you with both solutions that I proposed. This also seems like a depth/breadth problem to me. One-on-one relationships help you go deeper with your intimacy, while the other option lets you taste various "flavors" of it. They both help you develop in the sense that they give you grounds to know yourself better and develop your communication skills. This may be a good time to think for yourself about pros and cons of both options. Choosing what you really want is easier that way. It is difficult to have both because of temporal and cultural constraints. I also wouldn't be too concerned with leaving her in the sense that you can't fake happiness. She will know that something's up long before you tell her if you feel resentful for being "trapped". You are young and exploration is best done at that age.

Just to make sure, are you perhaps watching a lot of horror movies, or reading horror stories? Reading books about the topic will not be much help, I'm afraid. In my experience, these kinds of thoughts may come up as a way to distract you from something that you don't want to experience. They lessen when you get to the bottom of what that is and let go of beliefs about it. Therapist may help you in that discovery if you can't find it on your own. Trauma is also a possibility. Is there any pattern to the arising of these thoughts? Do they come up in similar situations, in response to something? That's a good starting point for contemplation.

It's not necessary, desirable, or probably even possible to abandon all perspectives, narratives or memories permanently. Experiences of long stillness may be helpful in seeing what lies beneath what we conventionally call "reality", but these experiences often are made into objects of clinging and elevated as "spiritual" as opposed to "mundane". It is much more helpful to learn to be equanimous in the presence of various experiences and seeing them for what they really are. It is, of course, easier when you have a solid point of reference accessed in meditation. I highly suggest watching Shinzen Young's videos on equanimity because it is an easily misunderstood topic.

I really enjoy just reading the nicknames of people attracted to this thread. Myself included

I'm in awe of the host, asking these questions with a straight face. It's like he's literally just wanting to know this guy's views and shows respect even when calling him out for his lies. That's admirable. What's also interesting is that when Peterson is pressed, he is not ashamed to admit that he does not actually know what Trump is doing. Right after stating his opinions on what he thinks that he should be doing. He's completely unfazed by his blatant ignorance. Is he not able to recognize it, or did he not learn to be ashamed of it?

Charade of a self? Slippery beast? Look who's not okay with herself today.

With itself. Actions match words.

Maybe he was a zen devil in the making? Thoughts about God don't have much value when not backed up by actions. Genuine understanding is consistent.

When everyone around you looks stupid, make sure that you have your glasses on.

Don't try to be a man. A man is an idea, a mental image, a set of standards to judge yourself by and reject the parts that don't fit. Even if someone described to you what being a man really is and was accurate, then it would not mean a single thing. That is exactly how toxic masculinity is created, by trying to make boys behave like men. We have cultural standards and pressure children to act/perform and in doing so we deprive them of the possibility to actually grow up, mature. That is what men are, they are boys that have matured. They did not mature by rejecting the parts of themselves that did not fit whatever standard their parents chose. They grew up by actually seeing what they are and learning how to be that effectively. And frankly, fuck women that buy into this toxic masculine standard and can't see for themselves what they really want from a partner. Why would you want to spend time with person is not really there with you, but constantly stuck in her mind, judging whether you are alpha or not? This is straight path to hell. Even worse is having your own mind constantly judging whether you are alpha or not. That's pure insanity and the condition most young men are stuck in. I wouldn't be surprised if that was the reason why men are so aggressive, because they are pissed at the self-harm that they are constantly inflicting upon themselves. There is just one single person you are supposed to be and you have to get close to him.

@Endangered-EGO When talking to unconscious people, you risk less when telling a dirty joke than talking about God seriously.

To add to other replies, porn is specifically constructed to cater to masculine fantasy. Pornstars are actresses that act this fantasy out. It is not wrong in of itself, but if young men get their hands on porn before they have sexual experiences, then they unconsciously construct what sex is supposed to be like. It is not supposed to be anything. It is simply two partners doing what the other needs. This is severely crooked in masculine fantasy, where she is doing what he wants, while he is just enjoying himself. No value can be extracted from watching porn, other than temporary relief from sexual impulse. I suspect that this is why there is a positive correlation between no-fap and success with women.